Fast (quick) Goldwings

The subject of Goldwings as compared to other motorcycles with regard to quickness has come up again. I think there might be folks riding the venerable 'wing who might not have first-hand experience as a basis for comparison. Others may not have seen the actual numbers. I'll use the age old yardstick of the 1/4 mile drag strip time and trap speed - the definitive measure of performance in the US for 75 years.

For starters, here's a summary of documented Goldwing 1/4 mile runs published in a variety of periodicals over the years:
GoldWing (and Valkyrie) 1/4 mile times seconds:

1975 GL 1000 12.95
1980 GL 1100 standard 13.18
1986 GL 1200 interstate 12.67
1985 GL 1200 LTD 12.88
1988 GL 1500 13.06
1997 Valk standard 12.37
2001 GL 1800 12.87
2004 GL 1800 12.71

Compare these numbers with the current list of top 1/4 mile performers (these numbers include the "trap" speed at the 1/4 mile mark. This is generally regarded as a good indicator of HP based on a power to weight formula. Goldwing numbers above don't include trap speeds.:

2012 Kawasaki Ninja ZX-14R 9.47 152.83 mph (245.96 km/h)[45]
2008[46] Ducati Desmosedici RR 9.49 152.80 mph (245.91 km/h)[47]
2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2 9.62 152.01 mph (244.64 km/h)[4]
2008 Suzuki Hayabusa 9.70 148.48 mph (238.96 km/h)[48]
2008 Ducati 1098R 9.75 148.6 mph (239.1 km/h)[5]
2013 BMW HP4 9.76 152.4 mph (245.3 km/h)[5]
2006 Kawasaki ZX-10R 9.76 149.08 mph (239.92 km/h)[5]
2015 Yamaha YZF-R1 9.83 149.91 mph (241.26 km/h)[8]
2014 Ducati 1199 Panigale 9.84 145.68 mph (234.45 km/h)[7][8]
2010 Suzuki Hayabusa 9.87 146.7 mph (236.1 km/h)[19]
2002 Kawasaki ZX-12R 9.87 146.29 mph (235.43 km/h)[49]
2004 Yamaha YZF-R1S 9.90 144.98 mph (233.32 km/h)[1]
2011 Ducati 1199 Panigale S 9.91 145.95 mph (234.88 km/h)[1]
2011 BMW S1000RR 9.93 149.8 mph (241.1 km/h)[50]
2014 BMW S1000R 9.94 141.74 mph (228.11 km/h)[51]
1998 Kawasaki ZX-9R 9.99 136.80 mph (220.16 km/h)[5]
2008 Suzuki B-King 9.99 138.42 mph (222.77 km/h)[1]

Bottom line: Three seconds elapsed time at the drag strip is an eternity. One second is a serious ass-whoopin'. Induction (i.e. carburetion) improvements might yield some incremental improvements (a few tenths of a second), but would, in no way, make any Goldwing competitive in the quarter mile with many of the motorcycles produced in the last twenty years. Even forced induction wouldn't do it. Things much deeper down would need to change.

But, everyone who's been in a GL saddle for any length of time knows deeply that it's not the point. If I wanted to travel from Phoenix to Nova Scotia by motorcycle, would I want to do it on a 'Busa or a Ninja? Heck no! At the end of the day, if I gave a rat's ass how my GL compared in the quarter mile to the guy at the light next to me, I wouldn't be riding it. I would never have sold my VMax's. Or my ZL's. Or my hot rod CB750 SOHC with the RC 912 kit.

On my '82 (has an '83 engine and trans), I am pretty sure my 1/4 mile time is around 14.9! :shock: :smilie_happy:
(Hence the reason she is named the "Slug") :hihihi:



But my "Slug" will pull my HF Tag Along trailer across the country non-stop except for gas stops. :yes:

Sport bike/goldwing...obviously no comparison for the long haul rides. Don't even need to ride either one to see that. The difference is acceleration and handling. Watch the dragon video posted of the yellow goldwing holding up the sport bike behind him.

I've test riden the '17 BMW 1000 RR and the Aprillia 1000 RF and ride my sons '17 GSXR 750. Rented a 1800 for the weekend on a trip to Phoenix. There's no way a goldwing of any year can pull better times than these bikes. The older 600 class sport bikes maaaybe but not these new track and canyon tuned bikes...no way.

You guys wait till I put cm85 dual cam and four valve heads on hooch.... :smilie_happy: seriously I ran with a crotchrocket in fla. it was a 1000 ....his bike was faster ...there were reasons it was faster that were not power related ....his shifting was with helical gears and super fast ...as the strait geared oldwing shifts much slower....his bike was at least 200 lbs lighter ...and the biggest thing was he had 8000 more rpm to run through than the oldwing hooch had ....there was places where hooch could out pull him in second especially...but there was no doubt his bike was faster...once in third gear hooch was to dangerous to keep it up with him ....so yes I agree the rockets are faster..and made for it...if I could get parts I'm sure I could make an oldwing 4 beat a stock crotch rocket screamer ..it would involve making a frame as good as rockets have so one could really open up a oldwing motor modded out ...if you think the techies have all over the backyard dogs your wrong...hooch proved so many things an oldwing can't do but can ...

Joe, we've never met, but I love you like a motorcycle brother. The internet wind-sharing bond is strong! But brother, you're truly living in a parallel universe or something. We're talking one motorcycle vs. another. But, you're suggesting massive changes - about 200 lbs of weight, 8000 more RPM to work with and an alternate frame. Each one of those things is a HUGE obstacle to overcome. Put them together and I say, "Case closed". The changes you have suggested are needed to make a Goldwing competitive make it no longer a Goldwing, really.

So, while you're figuring out the frame mods that will handle all the power your flat four is making, you might as well see if you can source one of these off ebay and bolt it up:

I really don't want to come off sounding like a jerk here. I truly love this motorcycle (and engine) design as much as anybody here. But, real demonstrable, documented performance numbers are hard to find. Mainly because most people are like me - they could care less. That's not what this motorcycle is all about.

But, digging around, I did come across some interesting stuff. Bonneville is where "Fast" gets its name, right?

https://www.bonnevilleracing.com/racing-teams/goldwing-racing-project/

And this fascinating story about early Honda road racing. Pay particular attention to Ken Hull's contributions later in the thread. It was his frame design.

https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/5-general-motorcycle-discussion-forum/343978-racing-gl1000.html

The power plant:

There was no one more surprised than me on the power in a oldwing motor .....your no jerk ...hell I like talking about stuff like this ...and your right I will never build a frame to handle the power I already have...to costly....all I ever listen too was ngw saying all the stuff that wouldn't work ...hooch proved ngw and randakks were just full of it ....like the one guy who had dual weber set up and it wouldn't beat a 1800.wing ...hooch will slaughter an 1800...easy...and run with the rockets ....I consider the ones blabbing stuff like they know it all and don't really have clue the jerks ...not debaters like going on here....

When I was younger in the muscle car days, before the Japanese invasion, spent a lot of time trying to make my cars go faster and handle better. American muscle was always good in the straight stretches back then, but lacked the agility through the twisties.

The other issue that always came up was acceleration. It's not how fast you can go but how fast you can get to the max power/speed ratio and maintain it for the distance. This is especially true in short races such as 1/4 mile. If you have time and distance on your side, there is no replacement for displacement.

I would also submit that a less agile, or powerful bike in the hands of a skilled individual can give more powerful bikes piloted by less expertise a good run for the money, even outperforming these bikes.

Took my '85 LTD on a track day last year, and was pleasantly surprised at how well it did. Saw a few jaws drop when I pulled into the parking lot from the boys on their sport bikes and such. I had already upgraded the suspension front/rear that helped as well. Keeping the FCW in the power band and quite often maxing out the RPM was quite the experience, and being able to dive into the corners because of the upgraded suspension enhanced the fun. I did this day to find out what I was capable of and what I could expect from my bike, had nothing to do with anyone else. Highly recommend trying this on a GW, lots of fun.

The bigger issue regardless of the bike is that anyone can go fast on a highway with sweeping corners and such. A person's skill level and performance of their ride in the twisties is a different story and is very telling of oneself. The other area of expertise that separates riders is the ability to pilot a 925 lb bike in close proximity and skill patterns that can raise your pucker factor to that of those doing excess speed through the twisties.

I further submit that there are those out there who can go fast and do sweepers and some good twist and turns, but cannot ride their bikes in the skill patterns that are seen in YouTube videos.

Having mentioned all this, it's not about you against the world, it's you and your bike, against you and your bike. Maintain, tweak, update/upgrade so that you feel good about yourself and your ride when in the company of others, this is all anyone can ask.

Just MHO.

Cheers

a 1200 Goldwing owner got offended because I thought my 1500 wing was a better bike than my 1200 wing. he said " a 1200 wing is faster in the 1/4 mile " to which I replied " who tours 1/4th of a mile, if I were only touring 1/4th of a mile I would take the Schwinn "

[url=https://classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=195137#p195137:2349e48j said:

detdrbuzzard » Sat Aug 26, 2017 7:20 am[/url]":2349e48j]
a 1200 Goldwing owner got offended because I thought my 1500 wing was a better bike than my 1200 wing. he said " a 1200 wing is faster in the 1/4 mile " to which I replied " who tours 1/4th of a mile, if I were only touring 1/4th of a mile I would take the Schwinn "

Click to expand...

:smilie_happy:

+1 :smilie_happy: :clapping:

I rode around the oldwing this morning checking it out for the trip North. What a beast it is compared to the KLR and the sport bikes. A VERY different animal, made to cruise long distances and do it well in comfort. There is nearly zero wind behind the huge windshield and fairing.
It gets up and goes pretty well, and I was actually surprised when I looked down and I was doing 60 in second. Sport bikes make you want to run the rpm's up high where the oldwing doesn't need to be lol.
Going to enjoy this 600 mile round trip. The others with their small shields and barely any fairing don't know what they're missing!

I find my wing very comfortable. After years of fighting the wind, wearing hearing protection just to hear myself think. I now enjoy every aspectof the ride. I seriously wish I had of got a gold wing a long time ago. :head bang:

[url=https://forum.classicgoldwings.com/viewtopic.php?p=195152#p195152:2lv9q73o said:

Ohara » Sat Aug 26, 2017 2:07 pm[/url]":2lv9q73o]
I find my wing very comfortable. After years of fighting the wind, wearing hearing protection just to hear myself think. I now enjoy every aspectof the ride. I seriously wish I had of got a gold wing a long time ago. :head bang:

Click to expand...

^^^ This is me! I rode naked bikes all my life. Never so much as a fly screen. (I wasn't sportbike guy, but a naked brute cruiser guy). When I happened on a neighbor selling his beautiful '84 Aspencade for a song, I couldn't pass it up. I instantly fell for the way that machine performed. I already had been a VW flat four enthusiast for many years. Once I got a GL, I was hooked. Wasted a lot of time before figuring it out.


Now, and for me, the "old" '97 Valkyrie is about as close to motorcycle nirvana (for this time in my life) as I'll ever find. I seriously don't think there's a machine out there that could replace it. None.

12.37 second quarter mile? Bah!

[url=https://www.classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=195153#p195153:28c9oz9u said:

desertrefugee » 4 minutes ago[/url]":28c9oz9u]

[url=https://forum.classicgoldwings.com/viewtopic.php?p=195152#p195152:28c9oz9u said:

Ohara » Sat Aug 26, 2017 2:07 pm[/url]":28c9oz9u]
I find my wing very comfortable. After years of fighting the wind, wearing hearing protection just to hear myself think. I now enjoy every aspectof the ride. I seriously wish I had of got a gold wing a long time ago. :head bang:

Click to expand...

12.37 second quarter mile? Bah!

Click to expand...

Goldwing is about enjoying the ride as much (more for me) as the destination. Though I do like to ride sport bike and KLR to get a change occasionally, and the Goldwing isn't going to go where the KLR can.

When I started riding I rode with several guys with much bigger bikes. I had a Suzuki GS400 and was riding with guys that had GS750s, KZ1000s, etc. They were good riders and rode like hooligans. I had to learn how to ride fast, or ride by myself way behind. There was no substitute for that kind of training.

But I've slowed down now and learned the true meaning of riding and that is enjoying it. I could care less if my bike could run a quarter in the 12s. All I really need is to be able to twist the throttle and pass a car without downshifting. The Goldwitch does that easily.

Yep couldn't agree more..

I'll never know the experience of a quarter mile time on my '83 1100 or my 1584cc Harley (W/ flyscreen), but I don't care. Both of them allow me to easily blend with traffic on a 70 mph freeway ramp or pass a truck at will at 80 mph. The beauty of the Harley is regaining speed after a tight corner but the Goldwing has all that wind protection for a cold morning. Had both bikes out for a 2000+ mile tour this summer and wouldn't rate one of them superior to the other. They are both quicker than "I" need and just a joy to ride. just my two cents, it's all part of the adventure!

Still love that trailer Kerry. (Coming from a non-trailer guy!)

+1 on the trailer. :good: