LOGIN  
Welcome to Classicgoldwings Chat Live Chat:   >   It is currently June 21st, 2018, 11:53 am
Who Is Online: davidomack, desertrefugee, Johnny Boy, Rednaxs60 .... 2 guests
Jump to:  

Portal » Forums » Repairs and Modifications » Shop Talk and Tech references » GL1100

Welcome to Classic Goldwings!
You are now viewing the forums as a guest which has very limited access to the forums.
Log in or create a free account.

Print view
Post new topic Reply to topic
Author Message

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#16  Unread postPosted: June 10th, 2018, 8:46 pm

User avatar
***
***

Joined: April 29th, 2017, 9:15 pm
Last visit: Yesterday, 9:33 pm

Total Posts: 66
Active Topics: 7

Location: Argo, Ia
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 1:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 84 GL1200 Asp, 79 CX500D, 84 CX650C, 81 GN400, 80 GS750E, 80 XLCH, C'dale Synapse, Shindaiwa 575, IC R22S, Guild X-702, SRV-220CC, CP-200, '42 10EE, CE-100V, 3-500Z, RG-80ES, Dual 6146's in a Seneca, 11-48, FM ZC-118

Profile

Valve Spring PRESSURES... not just clearance... PRESSURE.

See, the valve has inertia. When you push it open, you take it from sitting still, to motion... and then to close it, the SPRING must push it back... but if there's a spring that's a little weak... the mass of the valve will resist the springs force, causing it to not close fast enough... and that causes compression and vacuum to go to pot.

Faster the engine is spinning, the more spring tension is required to keep them from 'floating'.

_________________________________



Top  

Online

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#17  Unread postPosted: June 11th, 2018, 6:12 am

**
**

Topic author



Joined: March 5th, 2018, 2:20 pm
Last visit: Today, 8:24 am

Total Posts: 15
Active Topics: 3

Local time: June 21st, 2018, 1:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 1980 GoldWing 1100
1998 Triumph Sprint 900
2002 Kaw Ninja 250

Profile

I know how to check clearances but are you suggesting I remove the heads, disassemble them and check the valve spring pressure? There are only 27,700 miles on the bike.

_________________________________



Top  

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#18  Unread postPosted: June 11th, 2018, 8:45 pm

User avatar
***
***

Joined: April 29th, 2017, 9:15 pm
Last visit: Yesterday, 9:33 pm

Total Posts: 66
Active Topics: 7

Location: Argo, Ia
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 1:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 84 GL1200 Asp, 79 CX500D, 84 CX650C, 81 GN400, 80 GS750E, 80 XLCH, C'dale Synapse, Shindaiwa 575, IC R22S, Guild X-702, SRV-220CC, CP-200, '42 10EE, CE-100V, 3-500Z, RG-80ES, Dual 6146's in a Seneca, 11-48, FM ZC-118

Profile

The 'Formal' way to test springs, is to release the keepers, take the spring out, and put it on a test tool... but on an OHV, it doesn't require removing the heads. Turn the crank 'till piston is at TDC, then push in on the spring holder... valve will open 'till it touches the piston, a little more push, and the keepers will be exposed, take 'em out (I use hemostats), then the spring holder will slip back over the stem, you can then take the valve spring out and test it...

But that's not what I do. I make sure the crank is not in a position for the cam to partially open a spring... then I push on the valve with my hand, and feel the pressure. A soft spring will, if your hands and brain are sensitive, be pretty noticeable. Pop the valve covers, and push on each valve with the palm of your hand... right on the back of the rocker. If one moves easier than the rest, pull and test them ALL, and replace any that are weak.

Some types of valve spring pressure tools will work in-situ, however, I have no clue if there's one that'll work on a GL motor.

Low miles guarantees absolutely nothing. Matter of fact, long years and LESS miles, means there's a higher likelyhood of sacked-out spring.

Why?

Because the engine sat in one position... with one valve open... for a decade or more.

I frequently revive engines that have been 'asleep' for half-a-century, and folks bring me engines that they THINK are 'shot'. When I'm faced with one that's been sitting for a long time, I pretty much assume that it'll need at least a COUPLE springs. If it's a flathead, I pull the head, lift out all the valves, clean the ports and seats, wire-brush the valves, clean out the guides with solvent, check spring pressures, use some lapping compound and a sucker-stick to bed the valves into the seats, then put the springs and keepers back in. Amazing how it helps out an engine... but I've pulled apart an engine that had 22 hours' runtime after a rebuild in 1947... and sat 'till 2006, and it started and idled fine, but would NOT make it past 1100rpm, on account of one intake, and one exhaust valve spring (on two different cylinders) that were totally shot... developing about 12lbs on a 60-lb spec...

But high speed miss... if it's not ignition triggering, it's a lean mixture, plugged up exhaust, or floating valve.

_________________________________



Top  

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#19  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 3:42 am

User avatar
Global Moderator
C5 Club

Joined: June 12th, 2010, 6:35 am
Last visit: Today, 6:13 am

Total Posts: 14806
Active Topics: 151

Total Images: 112
Location: eastern Ohio
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 3:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 98 Valkyrie, 84 Standard, X2 80GL1100,81GL1100,82KZ750,81 Seca750 ++

Profile Personal album

Sounds right to me.

_________________________________

Vote NO on taxes, levies, and incumbents.
Every day I learn I know less than I thought I did.
Every time something is made idiot proof. The world produces a better idiot!
Maturity like wisdom seldom arrives without age. Far too often though age arrives without either.
ImageImage Image
Politicians are like diapers. They need changed often. For the same reason.
A fine is tax you pay for doing wrong. A tax is fine you pay for doing well.
Second place makes you first loser.


Top  

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#20  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 4:51 am

User avatar
**** **
**** **
Site supporter

Joined: February 1st, 2015, 9:29 am
Last visit: Today, 4:47 am

Total Posts: 1660
Active Topics: 31

Total Images: 69
Location: Euless, TX
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 2:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 1986 GL1200A "Goldie"
2016 HD FLTRU "BB"

Profile Personal album

Good post DaveKamp!

_________________________________

25712
Riding anything is a good day

Mike


Top  

Online

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#21  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 8:56 am

**
**

Topic author



Joined: March 5th, 2018, 2:20 pm
Last visit: Today, 8:24 am

Total Posts: 15
Active Topics: 3

Local time: June 21st, 2018, 1:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 1980 GoldWing 1100
1998 Triumph Sprint 900
2002 Kaw Ninja 250

Profile

Thanks Dave. I will try to feel for a week valve spring by hand with the valve covers off. I understand what you are suggesting. I'm 99% sure the ignition spark is good. New coils, new wires, resister removed from plug cap and hot w/relay to the coils. I've been in the carbs. Correct float heights, correct and clean jet sizes. New Mac exhaust.

I'll report back after I try this in a couple of days. Thanks again all for your help.

_________________________________



Top  

Online

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#22  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 4:17 pm

**
**

Topic author



Joined: March 5th, 2018, 2:20 pm
Last visit: Today, 8:24 am

Total Posts: 15
Active Topics: 3

Local time: June 21st, 2018, 1:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 1980 GoldWing 1100
1998 Triumph Sprint 900
2002 Kaw Ninja 250

Profile

OK, popped off the valve covers. First re-checked the valve clearances, all good. I then pushed the rocker arms at all the valves. With a thick piece of hard rubber in the palm of my hand I could move them all. I couldn't tell if one was weaker than the others. They all felt the same. It did take a healthy push to move them.

I should also mention that the miss also happens when I put a heavy load on the engine. Like when I'm in a high gear at low (3K) RPM. Or climbing a steep hill before I downshift. It's not a pre-ignition pinging, it's the same as the high RPM miss.

Because the bike starts, idles and runs so well (except for the dang miss!) and the carbs don't leak I didn't do a full rebuild. I just checked the jet sizes and made sure they weren't plugged, confirmed the upper slides moved freely and checked the float height. I understand the air cut-off valves can't be reached unless the carbs are separated from the pleneum, which I didn't do.

Could that cause the high RPM/heavy load miss? Could this be a carb problem?

Sheesh....

And in the back of my mind I'm wondering if the non-stock Mac (loud) exhaust has something to do with it.

_________________________________



Top  

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#23  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 4:41 pm

User avatar
**** **
**** **
Site supporter
knocker
C5 Club
Single Carb Club

Joined: December 3rd, 2009, 8:59 am
Last visit: Today, 6:06 am

Total Posts: 20677
Active Topics: 822

Total Images: 4096
Location: Van Nuys Ca.
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 11:53 am
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 1983 Interstate with '84 1200 engine, Solex single carb, and C5 ignition.
2016 KLR 650
My Bike Logs forum link: http://classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=122

Profile Personal album

My YouTube Channel
Have you tried fresh spark plugs?

Seems obvious I know, but I’ve chased problems similar that new plugs fixed.

_________________________________

PLEASE! Use your Gallery album for saving pictures instead of using attachments or picture sharing sites, especially technical reference pics. This will make sure your images will ALWAYS be in your post and the discussion thread will make sense!
Go HERE and learn how to use the Gallery.


Image Image ImageClick to order CGW Stuff

If you know someone can embroider our 3" patch, let me know!
My photo gallery
How to use the Gallery, Part 1, Part 2

How to add your bike photo to the rotating banner and our Banner Rides Page.


Image


Top  

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#24  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 5:18 pm

User avatar
Global Moderator
C5 Club

Joined: June 12th, 2010, 6:35 am
Last visit: Today, 6:13 am

Total Posts: 14806
Active Topics: 151

Total Images: 112
Location: eastern Ohio
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 3:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 98 Valkyrie, 84 Standard, X2 80GL1100,81GL1100,82KZ750,81 Seca750 ++

Profile Personal album

Are you running ATF or seafoam in the fuel? Are all the plugs gapped the same? Are all the resistor caps the same resistance?

_________________________________

Vote NO on taxes, levies, and incumbents.
Every day I learn I know less than I thought I did.
Every time something is made idiot proof. The world produces a better idiot!
Maturity like wisdom seldom arrives without age. Far too often though age arrives without either.
ImageImage Image
Politicians are like diapers. They need changed often. For the same reason.
A fine is tax you pay for doing wrong. A tax is fine you pay for doing well.
Second place makes you first loser.


Top  

Online

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#25  Unread postPosted: June 12th, 2018, 8:39 pm

**
**

Topic author



Joined: March 5th, 2018, 2:20 pm
Last visit: Today, 8:24 am

Total Posts: 15
Active Topics: 3

Local time: June 21st, 2018, 1:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: 1980 GoldWing 1100
1998 Triumph Sprint 900
2002 Kaw Ninja 250

Profile

I run a few ozs of ATF in every tank. I just today burned a whole tank with 5 ozs of Seafoam. I run nothing but pure gas, no ethanol. The plugs are new, just checked the gap today. I removed the resistors from the plug caps. Replaced them with a piece of solid copper wire. Same size as the resistor. The plug wires are new copper. The coils are new. Straight hot from the battery to the coils, with a relay. The battery is 6 months old.

I gotta have the best spark on Earth.

I ordered a 12mm adapter for my compression tester today. I'll check that when it comes in.

Either one of you guys or me is going to solve this mystery sooner or later. Keep the suggestions and ideas coming. I really do appreciate the help.

_________________________________



Top  

Offline

 Post subject: Re: High RPM miss
Share Post: Share on FacebookShare on TwitterShare on TumblrShare on Google+Share on MySpace  Post Number:#26  Unread postPosted: June 15th, 2018, 12:15 pm

User avatar
**** **
**** **
Site supporter
Single Carb Club
C5 Club

Joined: December 8th, 2009, 1:21 pm
Last visit: June 19th, 2018, 4:26 pm

Total Posts: 17681
Active Topics: 185

Total Images: 1718
Location: chuluota florida
Local time: June 21st, 2018, 3:53 pm
Country:  United States (us)
My Bike Models: A bunch in the works

Profile Personal album

My YouTube Channel
Hmmmmmmm this is a rare problem ...oldwings mostly miss and fart art around at mid rpm

_________________________________

Image

thank god and hooch im gone


Top  
Post new topic Reply to topic


Print view |
LOGIN  
Welcome to Classicgoldwings Chat Live Chat:   >   It is currently June 21st, 2018, 11:53 am
Who Is Online: davidomack, desertrefugee, Johnny Boy, Rednaxs60 .... 2 guests
Jump to:  

Portal » Forums » Repairs and Modifications » Shop Talk and Tech references » GL1100

Welcome to Classic Goldwings!
You are now viewing the forums as a guest which has very limited access to the forums.
Log in or create a free account.

Display topics from previous:  Sort by  

Contact Us Terms of Use Privacy Policy

The views and opinions expressed at this public user forum are those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect the official policy
or position of Classicgoldwings.com, it's moderators or administrators, or it's forum founder or owner.
Any content provided by our bloggers or authors are of their own opinion, and are not intended to malign any religion,
ethic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.


Copyright © classicgoldwings.com All Rights Reserved

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group


CGW - Chat