83 Aspencade Blown Head Gasket

[Jcol]

I have been looking for a parts or project bike for some time now. Today I bought and 83 Aspencade which the PO parked last September after the bike started to produce a large amount of white smoke from the left side. A loss of coolant level seems to point to a head gasket. The bike itself is in good condition but needs some TLC. The fairing and bags are in good shape however the trunk top has some blistering. The seat has a small rip but all in all I think it will clean up fairly good. I will be picking up the bike in a couple of days. Couple of questions. Should I change the oil and fire it up before starting the head gasket repair? This would be to just confirm that the engine is otherwise OK and doesn't have a major knock or other bad sound the would indicate something more serious. As for the head gasket itself, is this a typical way they go or could something else create white smoke and a loss of coolant? If I go ahead with the head gasket repair I will be back with lots of questions. I had a look for a guide but didn't see one.Any advise or help will be appreciated. Thanks.

 

[slabghost]

Might be a good idea to check piston walls for rust before you try turning over the motor.

 

[Tory]

I would just go ahead and do the head gaskets.But would do the T-belts,T-stat,Hoses and a Water Pump at the same time.
The Water Pump will also cause an exchange of fluids,but if it is as bad as you say,and mainly one side it is probably a head gasket.

Its a fairly easy job,but it makes no cents to go back in twice,so do it all and get r done and enjoy years of trouble free use.

FWIW I would aslo recomend using HONDA gaskets,and take it from someone whom has learned the hard way.

 

[Jcol]

Thanks Tory

I was planning on doing the timing belts at the same time. I wasn't thinking about doing both head gaskets since the PO was fairly clear about which side was producing the white smoke however since it's going to be apart anyway I guess I should do both sides?

 

[joedrum]

im not so sure if thats the way to go .... why .....head gaskits are redicluesly exspensive belts i can see

 

[dan filipi]

I'd be concerned since coolant has been in the cylinder it may have rusted the cylinder wall. Depends how long its been sitting this way would be the deciding factor whether I would start it or not.

I have a good 83 engine that now has a bent valve because I started it after sitting for 10 years. Rust built up on an intake which held the valve from closing and bent it. If I hadn't started it I could have saved the valve but that would have meant pulling the heads anyway to clean the valves.

 

[Jcol]

At first I thought I would put some ATF in through the spark plug holes and let it sit for a day or two, then carefully turn the engine over using the stator bolt. If all seems smooth then do a brief test fire. It's only be sitting since last September, but perhaps I should be more careful and simply go right to the tear down. I'd just feel better knowing that it runs before I spend the time and the money on belts, gaskets etc. Decisions, decisions.

 

[dan filipi]

I would pull the carbs and have a look at the intakes for rust build up before turning it over.

 

[Jcol]

Picked up the bike this evening. Coolant is leaking out of the left muffler at the joint near the left foot rest. Seems like alot of coolant is still in the cylinder and exhaust. Should have the parts by the weekend but I hope to start the tear down tomorrow.

 

[dan filipi]

Coolant may have seeped past the rings into the oil.
Put a oil and filter change on the list for sure.

 

[Jcol]

Well the head is off and here are some pictures. It appears that the head gasket let go on cylinder #3. Could someone take me through the next steps of setting the head gasket? I know that I have to clean off both surfaces and torque the bolts. It there a pattern and do you torque up to a certain point before going to the max? Any tips would be appreciated. I will probably reinstall the head on Saturday as I need to go out and rent or buy a torque wrench. Thanks.

 

[dan filipi]

Well if you want to do it right the head really should be surfaced to make sure it's flat.
I've read this can be done on a sheet of glass and sliding the head across sand paper but never done it.
I choose to have a shop rework the heads like they should be, have the guides checked/replaced, lap the valves and replace the seals.
The last pair of heads I had done cost me about $275 including 4 guides. I supplied the seals. I feel it's worth it since I believe most failed gasket replacements could be avoided if the head was done properly.

Cleaning.
I use a razor blade. Slide it across the head and block careful not to gouge the aluminum.
Need to get the mating surfaces completely clean. It takes some time.
Prior to assembly I wipe the block and head surfaces with carb cleaner. Rubbing alcohol is good too.
The idea is the surfaces need to be clean and completely oil free.

I coat both sides of the gasket with copper coat. 2 coats.

 

[joedrum]

first thing is to move the cam so the cam is in the nutrual possition ...and the valves are all closed ...then the head sould be cleaned up i the combustion chamber ...i always use a chor boy silver kitchen scrubber,...they are easy to use with touch ...dont even worry about the gaskit surface yet ...just the combustion chamber ...then after its clean in the combustion area it can be checked for valve seating by sticking a pen light bore scope light in each intake and exhast port in a darken room and check for light breaking through around the edges of the valves ....it will probably pass ...this head gaskit shows all the signs of a boxer motor that blows out the bottom wher all the fluid would drain if it there ....over a long period of time of sitting it can deteriate the gaskit to failure ....dosent look like anything else going on ...this a sure sign that the carb was leaking into the cylinder ...so something to think about there ...all in all it dont look to bad to me ...

as for milling an interference motor head ...im not a fan of this unless i knew for sure it was warped ...it shows no signs of it to me ....these heads are small and souldnt pose much a problem here to me ... unlike most if i check a head for flatness ...i check it on the motor wher it gose ....on a old wing this is easy ...there are various ways to do this ....lightly snug up up and looking at tell you need to see or know .....

cleaning the head surface ,,just needs to be done with the upmost touch and patience ...me i use scrub boy pad and and various othe stuf ...the thing here is never pressure that trys to go below the surface level ...its easier and quicker once you get the hang of it....only after everything is clean motor and head can you check it on the motor if you want ...i doutb very seriously there any warpage problem .....

bolt holes nedd to be cleaned the best you can take lot of time here as you want everything consitant for the torqueing to work right .....bolts to ...everything around this head sould be cleaned the best you can ....

 

[dan filipi]

The 4 GL heads I had surfaced showed low spots all over them and away from the bolt holes.
Might have been fine but I've always had auto heads surfaced so I couldn't see an exception here.
Since this is an interference engine the idea is only to take enough off to make it flat, no more.

Head bolts and Torquing.

As with the gasket surface the bolts must be clean but also the threads in the block.
It's especially important because these are torqued to only 40 lbs and bad or dirty threads could prevent a proper torque.
I clean the bolts and inspect the threads. The bolt holes I spray in carb cleaner and blow out with compressed air then smear grease on one side of the bolt and thread it in by hand til it stops.
It needs to thread in smooth and deep enough so I measure the bolt head it went in far enough.
The reason I do this is I had a head gasket let go I think because one bolt didn't thread in smooth.
When I torqued it I thought it pulled down but it didn't so I'm real careful here.
A build up of old grease and dirt in the thread holes can cause the bolts to "bottom" making them feel like they're torqued but actually not.

The manuals say 25 lbs then 40 final torque.
I first "seat" all the bolts just snug with the ratchet, then a bit tighter with the ratchet, then torque to 25, then 40.
Most importantly is torquing them evenly in a criss cross pattern working out like in this picture from the manual.

Since I had that head gasket let go I make multiple passes on the final torque.
The last one I did I counted 5 times to get all bolts evenly torqued.

 

[Jcol]

Great advice thanks. I have borrowed a torque wrench so tomorrow will be prep day. Question about the cylinder. Assuming that coolant has washed the oil away should I just shoot some oil on the walls and wipe it down and then rotate the motor a few times to re-distribute some oil on the walls or should I clean it with something first to remove any anti-freeze residue?

 

[dan filipi]

Great advice thanks. I have borrowed a torque wrench so tomorrow will be prep day. Question about the cylinder. Assuming that coolant has washed the oil away should I just shoot some oil on the walls and wipe it down and then rotate the motor a few times to re-distribute some oil on the walls or should I clean it with something first to remove any anti-freeze residue?

Sure, doesnt hurt to coat it with some regular engine oil.
I wouldn't be concerned with it beyond that but do change the oil and filter in case coolant got in the oil. Antifreeze will damage the main bearing shells.

 

[joedrum]

id clean the piston tops alsoall it takes is one piece of crud to screw the head job up ..adding oil hmmm maybe ...but me i would just go clean and dry ...it will only take a few seconds and the motor cylinder will be oiled again ...i woulnt want anything but motor head and gaskit anywhere near the head gaskit replacement at all ....after it torque and done you can squirt in all the oil you want through the plug hole

 

[Jcol]

Had a bit of a setback yesterday on the head gasket repair. I spent most of Saturday preparing the head and the block surfaces. I got both very clean. I took much of the old gasket off using a razor blade knife as Dan suggested. It worked well but after I got most of the stuff off I found it very easy to leave little marks as i got down to the bare metal surface. I finished off by spraying the surface with brake cleaner and lightly sanding with 800 sand paper. This removed the last of the stuff and did not leave marks. I cleaned with another shot of brake cleaner. After checking everything twice I set the motor to T1 and rotated the head to the up position, then installed and torqued to 25 then 40 lbs using the torque pattern. I went around the bolts at 40 a couple of times and all seemed OK. At that point I called it a day. Sunday morning I realized that I had forgot to install the low 10 mm bolt that holds the end of the water passage on the head. Since it's not part of the head bolt torque sequence I went ahead and found the torque setting which is 8 lbs and proceeded to install it using my torque wrench. It seemed to thread in OK and it never got much resistance and before the wrench ever clicked the bolt snapped off. I'm not sure if my wrench just doesn't work well at the low setting or if the bolt was simply bad. Either way after a bit of :sensored: I realized that I would have to remove the head, which I did using the reverse torque pattern down to 25 lbs then out. I then had to drive to town to get a small Easyout type bit to get the bolt out of the head. Had to buy a whole kit instead of just one bit. The bit worked well and the broke part of the bolt came right out within 10 seconds of drilling. The original threads were not damaged. So my question is did I ruin the head gasket or is it OK to reuse? The gasket came right off leaving no pieces on either the block or the head so I went ahead and reinstalled it and retorqued the head. I found a 10 mm bolt and this time I used a small socket wrench and just tightened it to what I thought was tight enough. I also put the timing belts back on and turned the motor over. It seems fine wth no interfence. I am away all week so I will not get back to it till next week however I would like to hear peoples thoughts about removing the head and putting it back on with the same gasket. I hope to hear that it should be OK. thanks.

 

[joedrum]

its not an either or deal ...you just have to gamble and try it ....id say you have a good chance it will work .... you diffinitly have nothing to loose by trying

 

[Jcol]

Yea, that's sort of what I thought. If it lets go again I now know how to do it and it won't take as long this time. I'll also already have new belts and I'll just have to remove the left side. Might even try to do it with the rad in place. But lets hope I don't have to do it again at all.