ETHENAL FUEL TREATMENT

[Tory]

Lately theres been alot of talk about the ethenal blends in fuels now days.In fact Wing World even covered it this month in a good article about gas quoting randaak and his veiws on ethenal blends today.

While looking around CRCs product catolog today,I found this PHASEGUARD4 and wondered what you guys thought of it.I orderded a bottle in today at work and I think it would be handy to carry along on a trip.The bottles have a measuring spout like STABIL has to make roadside fill ups easyer.Heres a link to the product

https://www.crcindustries.com/phaseguard4/ Check it out and give me youre input.

 

[dan filipi]

Since I don't have any direct experience using the stuff and I haven't read the article, AND I haven't experienced any bad effects with ethanol (yet) I can't really say one way or the other.

With all kinds of products on the shelf that claim improvements for this or that that do little if anything I'm skeptical.

They kinda just say it prevents something from happening.
I wonder, how does a guy know if this stuff is actually doing anything?

It seems like the product is targeted mostly for marine and storage applications anyway.

Since our fuel pickup is at the bottom of the tank, riding often seems like the best preventative maintenance to me.

 

[BigAndrew]

I dunno... Who's gonna be our guinea pig :mrgreen:

 

[Tory]

Dan,I agree with you.Unfortunitly up here in the snow belt we dont get to ride all year.But my biggest concern is the fuel blends.
I havent had issues either,but michigan just started mandating 10% ethenal blends last year and I dont have any experiance knowing what I may or may not have problems with.
Being a supplier to service centers with gas stations,I been told alot of complaints of lost millage and dirty fuel filters since the change last summer,but then again it seems to have leveled off so maybe it was just the initial change to the gasahaul.

It was randaaks words that got me back to thinking again about it(thats dangerous) Im not a huge fan of Wing World.Its to much advertising and way to much wing ding,(its free with the membership)but randall washington(randaak) is a expert on these wings and he got me going on the ethenal deal after reading the article.

I tried the ATF,but dont care for the smell and smoke.Other than that it seemed OK.

I guess Im just looking for input from you guys who have been running 10% etehanal for years.

 

[dan filipi]

I guess Im just looking for input from you guys who have been running 10% etehanal for years.

The pumps here have said "May contain up to 10% ethanol" for years and I haven't seen any problems, that I know of anyway.

The only fuel related problem I've ever had which I can say for certain were because of bad fuel was once in Baja Mexico about 25 years ago and once in Louisiana. Both times my car ran like total crap. I had to fiddle with the timing to keep going. The time in Louisiana the fuel filter plugged up solid with some kind of yellowish goo.Never did figure out what that was. I blew thru the filter in reverse to clear it then replaced it in the next town, and fresh gas from a busy station.

 

[Joep]

Been using the blends for a few years.. and other then not so great milage... (did go down) had no issues with need to rebuild carbs or anything.. then ethanol is supposed to help thin the gas supply so we use less.. and up to 10% is what the FEDS now mandate.. and then there are the botique gasses... like in CA to meet CARB standards..

 

[mcgovern61]

I have not read the article, but here in NJ, there has been a drop in MPG for everybody since we were adding MTBE to gas and then had to change over to ethenol blend. I know for fact that boaters are having huge problems with ethenol around here. In the winter, the water seperates from the gas easier when sitting and fouls the whole fuel system if not stabilized. Many of the rec boat gas tank seals have been leaking from the drying out from ethenol and the 2 strokers are complaining about engines wearing down faster because the gas has less lubricity. Older boat carbs (which are most boats around here) are having seal problems.

I would just as soon go to biodiesel than have to use ethenol. It does help with stretching the gas supply and helps with CO2 emissions, but it does have some unfortunate side effects. Thanks to Joedrum (yeah Joe! :clapping: ) we at least can overcome some of this with ATF. Having older bikes and carbs does give us some advantage on how we approach additives. But the poor guys with fuel injection are at the mercy of the gas they get!

I would like to note that all new vehicles today have their fuel systems and computers designed to run with these gas products as required by law.

 

[BigAndrew]

They been doing the 10% ethenol thing here in florida for awhile now and i didnt really notice a difference except a tinni winni drop in mpg, Im assuming its that or our gas prices stay at $4 a gallon

 

[AApple]

The push for ethanol in fuels is done mostly, from what I unnerstand, to help clean up the emissions, and to allow the manufacturers more feedback/R&D on future engine fuels. The dumb thing is, it takes twice as much fuel(ethanol) by volume to create the same amount of energy, so fuel mileage itself is NOT going to be better with ethanol/ethanol blends...
Smaller engines will prolly work better, long range, for ethanol blends, but how long will it be before we actually see a 1.4 liter, ethanol fueled, 300+ HP automotive engine in a production car that gets 30-40mpg?

The issues with the ethanol blends in our fuels now is as has been said...the rubber components in our older vehicles(autos, bikes, boats, etc) are NOT formulated to endure alcohol fuels. Nor are the harder plastic components. Then you also has alcohol's natural tendency to absorb moisture, which leads to rust in steel fuel tanks, as well as corrosion on aluminuminum components,not to mention rough running engines due to the water, since H2O isn't really combustible....at least not normally!
Modern rebuild kits for carbs are supposedly alcohol friendly, but I don't believe it.
Fuel injectors are another issue all together, since in a lot of infector designs, the fuel runs around the coil windings, helping to keep the infectors cooler. Some of the coatings on the wire used for the coil windings will NOT survive with alcohol...it breaks the coatings down, and then you have shorted windings...which means ya gotta replace the infectors.....and then the cycle starts all over again.... :head bang:

The ATF deal will certainly help with some of these problems, such as seal damage/drying, and lubrication issues, but it's not a cure for over-rich ethanol blends.... :read:

 

[dan filipi]

They been doing the 10% ethenol thing here in florida for awhile now and i didnt really notice a difference except a tinni winni drop in mpg, Im assuming its that or our gas prices stay at $4 a gallon

OUCH, 4 bucks a gallon eh?
I thought we get it in the behind here in L.A! :whip:

 

[mcgovern61]

They been doing the 10% ethenol thing here in florida for awhile now and i didnt really notice a difference except a tinni winni drop in mpg, Im assuming its that or our gas prices stay at $4 a gallon

OUCH, 4 bucks a gallon eh?
I thought we get it in the behind here in L.A! :whip:

At least here in NJ we are only paying $2.43 for regular.

 

[joedrum]

the gas is just as crappy as it gets....and if the treatment is made to work in modern cars and bikes then its not going to be the best for these old wings we have

so iwont be waisting any money on it.....

theres a lot more wrong with the gas than just the alcohol ...its been striped of its heavy oils content .....the gov has got to be realy stupid to take food off the table and put it in the gas tank.... thers not one benifit in using alcohol in the gas....it cost way more to produce than gas ....its just a energy negitive product..

 

[BigAndrew]

OUCH, 4 bucks a gallon eh?
I thought we get it in the behind here in L.A! :whip:

:blush: I ment when the gas Was $4 a gallon, It seemed the gas price droped after they started the 10% ethenol blend

 

[roncar]

At least here in NJ we are only paying $2.43 for regular.

Was not that long ago that $2.43 was an outrageous price for gas. Now we think it's a bargain. Don't you love how the oil companies condition us? :rant:

 

[AApple]

Ain't that the truff?
Anybody else remember .25 cents a gallon for PREMIUM? I do.....I miss the good ol dayz.... :crying:

The Guv-ment is also pushing for the ethanol to "help" the farmers...so they say. Most real farmers are struggling as it is, and the Feds are taking farmer's land and subletting it to grow corn for ethanol production. What a sweet deal, eh? :rant:

 

[dan filipi]

At least here in NJ we are only paying $2.43 for regular.

Was not that long ago that $2.43 was an outrageous price for gas. Now we think it's a bargain. Don't you love how the oil companies condition us? :rant:

Yeah. It's cute how they raise is, then lower it, raise and lower, but it never comes down to what it was before they raised it.
Is there anything else we use that's manipulated like that? I can't think of anything.

 

[Tory]

.....the gov has got to be realy stupid to take food off the table and put it in the gas tank.... thers not one benifit in using alcohol in the gas....it cost way more to produce than gas ....its just a energy negitive product..

Joe,you been talking to randall?Thats almost exactly what he says.Along with a few explicits about the lobbyist who pushed the corn fuel to begin with.

 

[Tory]

Sounds like you guys who are used to running the gasahual havent had much problems,maybe I shouldnt worry about it.

But the again,you all noticed a huge increase with the ATF treatments and I didnt :headscratch: does that mean you all have carburater issues with the ethenal that I didnt without the ethenal? :headscratch: Or did I just recieve a placeibel? :lol:

Either way,it doesnt sound like this stuff is the answer.
Maybe a little ATF dose every oil change or so just to keep her running good.And not worry so much about a problem I dont have. :yes:

 

[Joep]

well as to the atf treatment.. I went 203 miles when I went to reserve... first time I made went that long before having to switch.. and at 4.5 gals for the reserve on mine that is 45 mpg ... up from 39-40 mpg//

 

[joedrum]

thats funny after reading your post joe and the numbers you posted made relize my figures were wrong ...i thought i was getting over 50 miles to the gallion but it was more like yours ......

simple math :rant: now i feel like an idiot...dont you love it when somthing comes along to put you in your place :smilie_happy: :smilie_happy: :mrgreen: