GL1000 Hard Start after sitting a while...

desertrefugee · Apr 29, 2017

...I try not to ask too many questions. Instead, I'd rather be one who kinda lends a helping hand. Unfortunately, in my case, that cannot always be the case. Every now and then, I run into something that irritates me enough to complain to the good folks who will listen.

My '78 sometimes sits for a while. A week, maybe two on occasion. If it has been a while, it tries to be stubborn coming to life. With full choke, it'll fire a couple of cylinders as soon as I hit the starter, but then it's pretty much nothing for while. I'll need to grind the starter (numerous 5 second bursts) for a while. Then it'll start to fire on a couple and finally start up.

With Dyna coils and .35" gaps, I figured the fire shouldn't be a problem. Nonetheless, I narrowed the plug gaps to .32", but it's still stubborn.

So, what say you gurus? Am I flooding the danged thing? Or is a couple of idle weeks enough time for the bowls to dry out and it just takes time for them to fill back up? Lazy fuel pump maybe, with pinholes in the diaphragm?

Once started, there's no other sign of an issue. Runs really well.

slabghost · Apr 29, 2017

Not certain exactly what the issue is. I'd check voltage at the ignition feed while starter is in use. I expect it will be very low. Maybe 9-10 volts. Running fresh power to it through a relay will fix low voltage. Google wiredgeorges coil mod. If it's the fuel I strongly suggest you run ATF in the fuel regularly. It not only keeps things clean. It stabilizes nicely and adds a little bit of kick in power. Doing either or both should help in starting easier.

joedrum · Apr 30, 2017

id say it probably a combo of things ,,,carbs leaking down ...there no accelerator pump on 1000 carbs ...iggy could be in low voltage situation ..tho it throws all it has while starting ...old resistant switches and wiring ...and the hall effect ignitions are quite inaccurate set up to begin with ...with the stock carbs and all the potential leaks and plug up problems they have ...it could be over lean or to rich ...when the adjustment screws seem like they dont do much ..it because there not ...and there something that overwhelming the screw adjustments ...to me ..the ignition and carbs dont live up to the motor at all and are the weakest link in it set up to me ....atf is oldwing carbs best additive ...

brianinpa · Apr 30, 2017

Are you sure the fuel supply is what it should be? How does it smell when it does finally fire off?

dan filipi · Apr 30, 2017

Surprising how little spark is actually needed if all the other mixes are met.

Sounds to me like fuel delivery since it runs good otherwise. Float bowls are empty so they have to be refilled by the mechanical pump that needs cranked to do so. After having an electric pump I wouldn't ever go back.

desertrefugee · Apr 30, 2017

Thanks for the ideas, guys. I think you're convincing me it might be a low fuel condition. I guess I could test that theory and, next time, pop the air cleaner lid and hit it with a shot of WD-40 and see it it likes that extra nip. Been too lazy to do that yet.

If that helps it pop off pretty much instantly, I guess that would confirm the carbs leaking down although two weeks seems a little quick for that to happen. I actually have a 1200 fuel pump left from the days I had my Aspy. Hmmmmmmm....

What does one do for a tach drive with the mechanical pump gone? No worries, I'll dig through the archives to get some ideas, but I have a hunch this might be it now.

Thanks again. Sure does help to bounce ideas off you boys.

dan filipi · Apr 30, 2017

Someone please tell me how the carbs can "leak down" while sitting. Where does the gas go since the float bowls are the low point. Do they somehow magically wick themselves empty?

desertrefugee · Apr 30, 2017

:smilie_happy: :smilie_happy:

It does seem two weeks shouldn't be time for the fuel to go where ever it goes. But, I do plan to try starting juice to rule out a lean condition. BTW, I never use anything more flammable than a petroleum based fluid, like WD-40. Ether can do expensive damage.

Ask me about my old GS1000 sometime...

dan filipi · Apr 30, 2017

I think more it's evaporation of the gas. Summer here I noticed it more an issue.

slabghost · Apr 30, 2017

Carbs are vented several ways especially when the motor isn't running. I'm pretty sure even heavy paints dry very quickly in your area. So unless it stays parked back in a cave where it's cool. Fuel will evaporate quickly and what fluids remain don't light off very easily.

joedrum · Apr 30, 2017

seems to me mostly ..side stands and boxer motors dont mix well ...

dan filipi · Apr 30, 2017

Some oil could seep past the rings if on side stand causing hard start also. Takes a bit to burn that away.

slabghost · Apr 30, 2017

Which brings the question. When it does begin to fire is it the right side first?

desertrefugee · Apr 30, 2017

You guys are reinforcing notions that I have had going through this. This motor, like so many, does smoke on the left side occasionally if left on the side stand. I thought that maybe oil might be preventing a good, clean burn on startup. (Probably was). But, I have been parking on the lift table lately with the bike vertical to see if that had any effect. Since then, the blue smoke has not been seen. (I don't see it on every startup anyway). Regardless, the stubborn starting is still there. If oil was a contributor, it's not the main one.

I don't really know which cylinders fire first. It seems sort of random, but I will pay more attention next time.

Thanks again for the discussion. I really think I may be experiencing poor initial fuel delivery. Takes some cranking to fill the bowls. I will see if a squirt or two helps next time it sits up a while. (That will become more frequent as it heats up out here - 104F predicted Friday). That heat may be doing what Dan's observations suggest. Speeding up evaporation.

Ansimp · Apr 30, 2017

Darrell, how about adding the electric pump as a priming pump to prove the low fuel on start up issue. :yes:

slabghost · Apr 30, 2017

Good idea. You can just join inlet and outlet on the stock pump and leave it for emergencies..

Ansimp · Apr 30, 2017

[url=https://classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=190021#p190021:2th4tm7p said:
slabghost » Mon May 01, 2017 6:25 am[/url]":2th4tm7p]
Good idea. You can just join inlet and outlet on the stock pump and leave it for emergencies..

I was thinking you maybe able to just plumb it in line after the manual fuel pump... Just some extra hose, temporary mounting and momentary switch. :whistling:

slabghost · Apr 30, 2017

Possible to do it that way but it adds flow resistance to whichever pump is being used. I still think that a fresh coil feed would do wonders.

mcgovern61 · Apr 30, 2017

I know with all that has been said this will be the complete opposite. My '82 has '81 carbs. When it had carb issues, they manifested exactly like yours! Pull the choke, instant start but then stop running. Try to start again and it seemed like it was out of gas as it would crank and crank choke or no choke, but no restart. Wait a few, close the fuel petcock and try it again and it would fire up.

My problem turned out to be flooding. I had two dirty float valves that were letting the gas flow right down and flood.

Tom_Charlton · May 1, 2017

Your remark about using an electric fuel pump stimulated this old brain.

1. Hook it up as a "priming pump" controlled by a push button. Run it before you try to start the bike to fill the carb bowls.

2. Install the electric pump as full time and leave the mechanical pump in place so the tach still works. Plumb the input barb to the output barb so you don't suck air (and dirt) into the mechanical pump.

It's raining here, so I got nothing better to do than offer advice.

GL1000 Hard Start after sitting a while...

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