Changed my mind on "Single-Carb"

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CC

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Hi again folks, sorry it's been so long. Im finally relocated in Calabash,N.C.
I did maybe 50 miles on my single carb conversion in 5-mile or so test-ride intervals between adjustments. And no matter what I do, it seems the rpm's need to be kind of high for the bike to run good. And the idle keeps wandering between 1100 and 1500 rpm's. Yesterday I finally went to Randakk's for a master rebuild kit price for the original 4-carb rack. While there, I checked his 2cents on single carb-conversions. I have to admit that he's right in that you can't argue with physic's and/or Honda. Im looking for practical transportation that I can enjoy in all rpm ranges, and get the 48 mpg's that the bike should get. Im guessing the single was getting 35 at best. So I've decided to eat my words and skip the single-carb deal and learn to sync the 4-carb originals. I've added a pic anyway, but would suggest to anyone considering a single carb to reconsider. Unless your talking a strip bike etc...

Can someone tell me if I can run the original carbs with just the "pull" cable??? -Thanks.
 

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Ansimp

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I would recommend push-pull for every application where possible, so in your case I would fit the original push cable back on :yes:
 

C5Performance

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I am not to the "carb selection" point in my GL dirt bike project, but I find the quad, dual, or single carb discussion interesting.

We have all read posts from riders using all 3 types of systems complain of running issues and frustration. We have all seen posts from riders who swear after changing to the "other" system their cycle runs better than ever before.

I'd caution a few things without asking 100 specific questions:

Honda used quad carbs, so we can argue they knew what was best for the GL1000/1100/1200 and when new, these bikes started and ran flawless.
But they dont after 30 years of use. Throttle shafts leak, carb kits get installed wrong, people don't replace leaking needle/seats. We can't control all those variables.

VW and others used single carbs on millions of Beetles and other flat 4 engines. I own one myself. It runs awesome. Quick starts, smooth idle, and no issues.
No Chevy, Ford, or Dodge came from Detroit with 8 carbs.

I think if multi carb engines dont run right (none of my GL's ever have) it is worn carb parts or crappy ignitions or probably a little of both.
If a single carb system doesnt run right I would first ask if you have the same plenum heater that VW used (no heat riser? Then expect a compromise in operation).

I do not believe Randakk is impartial since he sells carb kits for stock carbs. I certainly am not impartial about ignitions (yes, the C5 is the BEST...just ask me).
No matter what we tell you, first ask yourself if the issue might be a simple lack of understanding of the carb you are using, or is it a fundamental problem with the theory of a single carb. Since almost all cars use one carb, i do not believe the theory of a single carb Goldwing is the problem. Hopefully no matter what system you choose works awesome when you are done!
 

slabghost

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Agreed. It seems you've been trying a single barrel. Pict 3 maybe? Personally I do believe it will work better the the stock rack. But there isn't yet much discussion on jetting for those and that manifold hasn't been heated. I wouldn't give up so quickly. Maybe try the adapter with the 2 barrel carb or try some different jetting with a little heat to the manifold. Or maybe both. An exact formula has not yet been devised. That looks like a very nice manifold. Maybe the runners are a bit over sized and need choked a bit? Maybe if the price is right someone else may want to try to get it right. Yes so far I'm running stock carbs but I've several single set ups here to try over the winter. Up to you to persevere or throw in the towel,
 

joedrum

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well all I got to say is this ......you can argue with Honda ...making these carb racks CV operated carbs ...just kills th advantage of four separate carbs ...simply by the time vacume works the slides for gas to flow...... the motor already needed it ...here starts the low rpm bike run like crap labors off ......

I have no experience with single barrel carbs ...right off the bat I discounted them as to marginal in rpm range to work for me as I was thinking the wide rpm oldwing is not the best match ....to get full rpm the oldwing is capable of ....

now a two stage weber ...witch I use is the perfect set up...... has one barrel for low prpm and the second that comes in at 45 % throttle ....the mother Honda CVfour set up doesn't have anything like that at all

the weber works basically on air from the front side of things ...what the motor pulling through the carbs ....not the after the fact vacume like the Honda set up ...the absolute slowest execution time fuel delivery ....

me im at the age that ive had serveral as in many 60s v8 cars with four barrels on them ...some with much more in carburation ...I was into it ...had cars that would really put out the power ...and then also drove around great on the streets in a responsible matter ...like perfect transportation ...plenty safe and streetable and racing power also ...we loved speed and power .....but there were the set up s that were just to radical for the street ..I had a few like that these cars were hard to go to work with....chore to drive ...get hot all the time trying to run slow ..loads of drivability problems .....but the basic muscle car of the 60 with four barrel was just the best set in the world ....nothing from the rest of the world even came close to American muscle .....

so on my moded 1200 is a weber two stage carb that runs as good as any 60s setup dual purpose motor ive ever had ...its instantaneous off idle ....when second barrel kicks in ..its another gear and playtime ...under that it rides perfectly and better than any Goldwing ive ever ridden ...it dosnt labor like cv stock set up cause it actually gets gas when it needs it not after the labor knock starts ....

you here all kinds of discounts on single carb set ups and the weber two stage carb ....stuff like they don't enough flow for an oldwing motor ...really...there design for motors bigger than oldwings ...seems every time I see a super charger on an oldwing theres a weber sitting on top ...yes one of those to small and cant flow enough carbs ....sheesh its all strait up discount ....

we have gotton to the point of being so plug and play wrenching ...that is held to mechanical ability ...its not ..never has been ..America is in the dunb down education and practical skills discount as being caveman like not civilized ..against the law ...

to the point that there not even mention of carb jetting in this post like you expect it to just run ..and if it don't because mother Honda and randakks is the only way to get it to run ....sheesh

reality is ...its a dam piss poor carb setup infected horribly by EPA idiots like cancer to humans ....it never was good only marginal ... and its just flat out easy to beat for people who are determin to have something much better than what was mass produced ....

if I were you iwould have had a thread here so the menbers here could have had input to help ...

not a thread of discount after the fact ... and no meat in the deal pass plug and play :builder: :mrgreen:
 

dan filipi

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It seems guys expect the singles to be bolt on and go.
The 4 carb rack should be held to that standard! LOL.

A single needs to be setup. They are not plug and play, yet.
One setup will be if we follow through with all the tweaks we're working on here.
 

dan filipi

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Question CC. Is this the manifold you made out of PVC you talked about in this post?
viewtopic.php?p=97422#p97422

I see right off the problems with the manifold you posted pics of above and why it won't idle down.
If you read thru the single carb threads you'll pick up on them.
A single is very workable, especially when heat is added.
I'm about to post about mine after adding heat.
 
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Thanks a bunch for everyone's feedback. I'll try to clear up some things.

"Yes", the manifold is pvc. And "no", I didn't heat the manifold like I should have. I blindly thought that moving down south should eliminate the need for heat. (yes I know, shame on me). It's over 20 years since I adjusted or worked with a carb, so Im re-learning what I thought I once knew. I had the manifold half-built when I first joined this site and should have done more shopping for some of the great experience and threads that were here for me. (relocating was tough and stressful; I was "with and without" the net for a time too). With everyone's help and hindsight being 20/20, I really like what joedrum said about the 2-stage webber. And I'll look for Dan's post during this coming week.
So OK, here's another bad that I did- or actually didn't do. I thought I could lean out my 34pict3 to get a good burn at the plugs. So I didn't re-jett the carb. My plug-n-play fantasy was truly doomed.
But thanks to everyone's responses; this is my plan- I've decided to keep the manifold- sell the 34pict3 on ebay- and look into a 2-stage webber in the spring. I had intended to restore the original 4carb-rack anyway because their original equipment to the bike. And this way I'll have a chance to do my own comparison on power and mpg's. I can then decide which I prefer to use full-time on the bike. And yes I'll add heat and look over this site for tuning-tips and advice. Im also pretty sure that I'll need some help with my rack's rebuild. I had downloaded a PDF on rack rebuilding the same night I got home from buying the bike, but don't remember from who. When I find it I will compare it with information on this site and go from there. I know it seldom happens, but I'd like to do it once and right. So I'll arm myself with all the info I can before actually starting the rebuild. Thanks again to all who replied!!! And don't forget what the bumper-sticker says: "It takes a special kind of stupid to think that criminals will obey gun-laws!!!" Everyone take care, CC
 

C5Performance

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CC,

I know it is overwhelming to read almost a dozen posts explaining single carb conversions but hang in there. If I'm sure of one thing, its CGW will figure it out and post one final list of everything needed to make it perfect. Toss in an ignition that works like it should and you will have a Goldwing with tire shredding power from idle to redline and beyond.

Thank you very much for posting your details. It helps us all see where you've been and where you are headed.

Paul
 
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Just a heads up that I'll be auctioning off my "Solex 34pict3 carburetor" on ebay tonight starting at 100bucks. It has the auto-choke and fuel cut-off solenoid with just under 50 miles on it. If anyone from this site is in on the auction I'll throw in the intake I had built. Just make sure you let me know that you read this postreply. (see pics in my last post). However bear this in mind- "the runner's are no longer connected to the plenum" and a bunch of the heat paint I had used came off due to fuel-spill while I disassembled it. So it has to be built and finished all over again along with a little J&B removal on tubes/plenum; but all the hard parts are done. And there are no breaks on the pvc. The tube lengths are fitted to be snug against the elbows while just long enough to reach,and go very slightly inside the plenum. I had used J&B cold weld which I did not mix correctly. (The carb mount to plenum is solid; so at least I got that right). It's not heated and may need to have the runners sleeved for proper operation. Obviously the carb would need re-jetting which Im not interested in doing. Im going with the webber and I have a different Idea in mind for an intake design. All carb mixtures are exactly as I received the carb. (I had leaned out the fuel mix by 1/2 of a turn only. And I never touched the air/fuel adjuster(the larger screw). I wasn't able to post in the "for-sale" section since Im still too new of a member I guess. So just FYI, everyone take care, CC (ebay ID: Freedomsnotfree)

(if I were rebuilding it again Id use rtv and mount a couple re-enforcement brackets between the left/right side of motor. But Im saying the heck with it since Im getting Randakks master carb kit today or tomorrow. And as I said I'll do it different next time. I know I could have gotten this set-up to work good/if not great with the wealth of info on this site; oh well; I'll wait for a my webber and new intake design anyway)
 
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CC

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Hi Dan, I tried but it said "locked". The carb is now on ebay anyway. Also, I finally may have a line on some work in my area. Cash has been tight for me like most people, but I did want to ask you what the typical donation amount to the site is? I appreciate not having all kinds of adds all over the place and also appreciate the wealth of information here. (Im not sure when I can donate, but I don't mind helping out when Im able to) Thanks, CC
 

dan filipi

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CC, you must be looking at the "For Sale and Archives" forum. Those are all locked.

Go here for the For Sale forum that everyone can post in, viewforum.php?f=14

P.S. Donate what ever you feel comfortable with.
 
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