Problem after Neon coil/relay mod

[steveb123]

New Neon coil, with relay mod.
Battery voltage at centre connection at coil.
Variable voltage (+1V, as per Honda manual) at two outer "switching" connections during cranking.
Boosted from the car so no issue with voltage.
Wires, boots and coil connections test fine.
Coil tests fine against published resistance values.
Coil connection checked a hundred times.


No freakin' spark at plugs grounded to engine.

Before I loose it....any thoughts?

 

[joedrum]

hmmmmm......sounds as tho relay is working ...maybe dan can help

 

[slabghost]

Coils grounded?

 

[dan filipi]

I would back up and remove the relay so it's hooked up as stock then see what you get.
That's my method of troubleshooting, bring it back to the point it was working then add in and test each as you go.

 

[steveb123]

Coils grounded?

For what current path?

Coils ground through the trigger signal, and through the plugs.
I've tested the stockers, and the new coil. There is no electrical connectivity between any electrical connection and the mounting ears.

 

[steveb123]

I would back up and remove the relay so it's hooked up as stock then see what you get.
That's my method of troubleshooting, bring it back to the point it was working then add in and test each as you go.

Thought about that, but the only thing though the relay is the centre power, and it's good.

Googling "MSD Neon coil failure" brings up a bucket load of results.
Sigh.

 

[dan filipi]

If you hook up the stock coils in place of the Neon coils, do you then get spark?

 

[steveb123]

If you hook up the stock coils in place of the Neon coils, do you then get spark?

Well, that would require butchering the new wires, and harness. I'm sure you can understand my reluctance.
Maybe I'll email MSD and get the full testing specs.

 

[ekvh]

What bike are you modifying? Keep us posted as to what you find. I may do this on my Frankenstein.

 

[dan filipi]

If you hook up the stock coils in place of the Neon coils, do you then get spark?

Well, that would require butchering the new wires, and harness. I'm sure you can understand my reluctance.
Maybe I'll email MSD and get the full testing specs.

That is why I always test before soldering and wrapping everything up.

I haven't seen your install but still might be the quickest way to narrow down the problem.

 

[steveb123]

If you hook up the stock coils in place of the Neon coils, do you then get spark?

Well, that would require butchering the new wires, and harness. I'm sure you can understand my reluctance.
Maybe I'll email MSD and get the full testing specs.

That is why I always test before soldering and wrapping everything up.

Well yeah.....but everything is new!
I can test wires/caps/coil in situ.... 5K-ish each for the caps/wires, plus the coil (advert as 12K). End to end on each is 23K, so coil secondary, wire, and caps are good. Apparently.
Coil primary tests within spec. The only spec I don't have is....well, I don't know what to call it.
Coil trigger lead (-) to secondary output. AFAIK, that is generally called the secondary, but on a wasted spark, I've read you test across the two outputs, which is what I've done, which is the aforementioned 12K.
Maybe I jumper the two high tension outputs, and test from THAT to the - terminal?

Figured I was going to AVOID problems by going for all new componants. HA.
Wanted a motorcycle. Got a glorious mechanical puzzle. :headscratch:

I guess when you buy them THIS experienced......

 

[steveb123]

A good nights sleep, and lovely day to poke around in the garage. Calmly. Methodicly, even.
Backed up to the bike three prong connection to test the coil connector. Good.

Test for spark directly at coil, with spark tester. No good.

Finally....hear CLICKING during cranking, and figure out where it's coming from. Originally thought it was the choke plates clattering around, as I could see the shafts twirling back and forth.

My relay mod relay was switching on and off during cranking :shock: !! NO idea why, but whatever. Clipped the B/W wire from bike connector, to the coil centre "power in" connector.

My ancient spark tester lights up.....crackle, crackle......under cranking.

:yahoo:

NOW I can see if all my carb rebuilding was any good!

Thanks for your assistance, one and all.

Edit: Buttoned thing back up a bit, and (ahem) corrected the eletricians faulty work at the relay connection. :smilie_happy:

It quite literally thumbed alive. After a winter, and after a carb rebuild.
Gently thumb the starter, and it was burbling happily away.

Insanely good starts now. Well worth it.....once you wire the relay correctly. :rocks:

 

[toytender01]

GO A TEAM. It's great when a plan comes togather. :salute: :salute: :salute:

 

[joedrum]

cool ...still watch it some for heat in the ignition parts

 

[dan filipi]

On and off while cranking,
Sounds like dirty start button contacts.

 

[steveb123]

On and off while cranking,
Sounds like dirty start button contacts.

No idea. Can't see how the start button would control ignition coil power.

Anyways, all good now.

 

[dan filipi]

On and off while cranking,
Sounds like dirty start button contacts.

No idea. Can't see how the start button would control ignition coil power.

Anyways, all good now.

Sorry, I was thinking the kill switch.

 

[Ansimp]

I often use an old headlight bulb or 55w handheld spotlight as a high current test light. Using a multimeter or a FI friendly test light will show voltage but not available current.

 

[Steve83]

On and off while cranking,
Sounds like dirty start button contacts.

Either that, or the relay was grounded through the ignitor circuit instead of the ground circuit...

 

[slabghost]

coil power was connected to starter side or solenoid instead of battery side.