Coolant Sludge?

[slabghost]

I've only had my 81 1100 a few months and it had a coolant leak in the crossover tube when I got it. I fixed it with new O rings but used only water as coolant in case it still leaked. So in prepping it for winter I drained the coolant after warming it by removing the bottom radiator hose. Now I have a large puddle of what looks like sludge in my driveway. It runs really good and I never noticed any white smoke from the exhaust that would indicate a blown head gasket. I suppose the PO may have put in some kind of stop leak. Any other ideas what might have caused this sludge?

 

[joedrum]

well Vince your saying it looks like oil sludge ....i guess it could be something from a previous blown gasket ....that's one of the reasons i like not having a thermostat it makes flushing the cooling system a snap ....anyway i hope its nothing but past sludge .....oh i read your post again stop leak you think maybe .... :mrgreen:

you know your going to have to figure this out completely :mrgreen:

 

[scdmarx]

A picture would sure help.

 

[joedrum]

okay whats going on on this figure anything out yet.....ive been worhing on my 83 and finished doing what i always do....no thermostat no heat shield and manual switch on fan ...man i hate that heat sheild what a pain to get out ... :mrgreen:

 

[slabghost]

It was already raining here when I read the suggestion of taking a picture and it is still raining. It seems to have washed away the sludge. Seems if it were oil it would still have left some so I guess I'll have to wait for the weekend to investigate further. In most cases where blown gaskets allowed oil and water to mix it always migrated from the radiator to the oil. Not the other way so I have hope that it just something minor.
I've been following your posts Joe. Good job. I may remove the heat shields on my bikes but I prefer to have the thermostats. It slows the flow of coolant a bit allowing the radiator to dissipate more heat.

 

[mcgovern61]

It sounds like the coolant that was in the bike before you changed to water was in there a long time which will build up scale in the radiator (hence the reason the coolant must be changed on a required schedule). Having just water in there is not a good idea with an aluminum engine. Aluminum heats up real fast and can boil water pretty quick if not properly cooled. I would assume that your water got hot enough to strip the scale and sludge in your radiator (not a bad thing except if the water gets too hot you can warp the heads real easy!) The antifreeze mixture also has anticorrosives in it.

If you had a blown head gasket like you mentioned, you could see water in the oil, but you could also see oil in the expansion tank.

 

[slabghost]

It sounds like the coolant that was in the bike before you changed to water was in there a long time which will build up scale in the radiator (hence the reason the coolant must be changed on a required schedule). Having just water in there is not a good idea with an aluminum engine. Aluminum heats up real fast and can boil water pretty quick if not properly cooled. I would assume that your water got hot enough to strip the scale and sludge in your radiator (not a bad thing except if the water gets too hot you can warp the heads real easy!) The antifreeze mixture also has anticorrosives in it.

If you had a blown head gasket like you mentioned, you could see water in the oil, but you could also see oil in the expansion tank.

Good to know. I learn something new every day. Since it's snowing here now I may just leave it empty for the winter.

 

[dan filipi]

I've always understood straight water to be better conductor of heat than a mix with antifreeze.
Now I'm confused.

 

[scdmarx]

I've always understood straight water to be better conductor of heat than a mix with antifreeze.
Now I'm confused.

As I understand it, this is true, but antifreeze (and a tight seal) raises the boiling point. Water can transfer heat to the radiator, but once it becomes a "gas" it doesn't work very well as a coolant. Water may also cavitate easier than a mix with antifreeze, but don't quote me on that. Little pockets of steam are like silent killers, creating hot spots in the nooks & crannies that don't show up at the temp gauge. The thermostats job is to keep the engine within a desired operating temp by controlling the flow to the radiator. I have seen car engines run hot because the thermostat was removed. Without this controlled flow, the coolant may pass through the system too fast to pick up the heat from the engine and transfer it to the radiator, and not spend enough time in the radiator to adequately cool before entering the engine. And I gotta wonder if fast moving coolant can promote cavitation? I suppose it all depends on the design of a given system as to just how prone they are to any of this. Some worse than others? But I suspect that our GW's have been through some extensive R & D in their developement. And I'm leaning towards the correct operating temp range for things like gas mileage and crankcase contamination, etc.

 

[mickeyc]

+1 on that sedmarx

The cooling system on motorcycles and cars is one of the most neglected systems of all. Most people think antifreeze is for freeze protection only THAT IS NOT THE CASE!!!!!
One of the most important things it does is protect aluminum and copper parts. It also helps stop cavitation and with additives like Phosphates it quickly reprotects any damage where cavitation has occurred. It also helps to raise the boiling point and with that radiator pressure cap it will raise it even more.

I remember when I first started my professional career we only had to stock one type of antifreeze, good old green. Now there about 5 or 6 different types what a headache.

The trouble started with the use of aluminum in engines. The old green antifreeze we used for so long just could not protect aluminum parts. So now we have OAT (organic acid technology) or HOAT (hybrid organic acid technology) with additives like phosphate, silicates, benzotria-zole, tolytrazole, and the list go on and on. We can’t even count on one type of formula to be used throughout a company’s entire line.

Some antifreeze is being sold as mix with anything and although I do use them some I try not to mix but will do a complete system flush and renew.

It is always best to stay with the companies spec for what ever you are driving. As for the Goldwing I don’t know what their formula is but I went with the Zerex Asian.

The other big mistake people make is going to long between changes. I don’t care if it checks’ good to -34 the additives do brake down and it can also become charged with voltage. YES I said voltage. Try this take your volt meter touch the ground led to engine block and put the Pos in your radiator coolant, if it has been in to long it can have an electric charge. Ford had a world of trouble with this in the past. Have you ever replaced the heater core on a ford and found a grounding strap in the box with instruction to clamp it to the heater line and fasten to a good body ground. Think about it what do you need to make a battery? Acid and two dissimilar medals. Remember the class experiment of putting a penny and a nickel in a grapefruit?
Diesel engines are even worse then gas for becoming charged.

Bottom line is use the correct type and change before needed!

 

[joedrum]

wow mic thanks for all that info i sure didnt know all that :rtfm: :headscratch: :mrgreen:

 

[Smokey66]

Mickeyc hit it on the head! LOTS of GOOD info there! :good:

 

[slabghost]

So, Mickeyc . Is there a specific coolant suited for our bikes at our local auto parts store?

 

[mickeyc]

When I looked in my shop manual it calls for Ethylene Glycol but I would put something a little better then that. I use Zerex Asian in all of the Asian cars I work on and it is what I put in my 75 GL100 mainly because i like the extra addatives used.The Asian makers use Phosphates to quickly reprotect any cavitation area and they use BZT or TTZ to protect copper/brass. One of the main things to remember is to FLUSH ALL THE OLD TYPE OUT BEFORE CHANGING. The newer types of antifreeze do not play well together. They tend to gel.
If you do use Ethylene Glycol change every 2 years. I would also change any of the long life types every 4 years even if they say 5 years. (and always flush the system!)

 

[Heath]

In answer to the sludge it could have been the PO mixed types. I know they will form sludge if mixed. If your not careful you can go in for "green" coolant and get that new crap that doen't play well with others.

I'm rebuilding mine after a timing belt break. I also just changed the coolant on the wife's jeep and it used the new G5 coolant because it's an aluminum block. I was thinking about using it in the wing too because it has more protectants.

I'm thinking as long as I don't mix them it should be OK and not sludge up.

 

[slabghost]

Whatever it was is still partly there on the driveway after all the rain and snow. It looks like mud and I don't see the tell tale rainbow colors that oil would leave. Once it warms over freezing I'll flush again with water then refill with antifreeze mix.