1985 GL1200 Limited ECU Replacement/Upgrade - Part 3 - Road Trials

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My intent is to now put together a schematic for a basic install that will work and replace the OEM ECU. I had this at the start so recreating it will not be an issue. May go back to this configuration as well. Can always upgrade later on to sequential fuel/ignition, but first to change to paired injectors and determine if I have a dash RPM indication or not. The Speeduino wiring was much less at the start as well. I will keep the wiring for the new barometric sensor. I mention this because one of my requirements at the start of this project is to be able to go back to the OEM CFI system. May have to get another wiring harness, this one has been modified a couple of times.

Going back to basics may tweak some interest in the GW community. The last piece of the puzzle will be getting a good base engine tune done from road trials, and detail how to set up the tuning software settings/parameters for others to follow. This is the challenge at the moment.

Will be heading back to Ontario for the month of July to my sister's for the last work period on the house and on return start the change/tuning process. Be off line for a while, but will monitor and comment if necessary.

Cheers
 
Back from my sister's place in Ontario. Lots of work done. My brother, Sonya and I have some 700 or so hours into the 30 year makeover of her husband's house - inside and outside. Looks good what we have done.

Getting back into the ECU replacement project. Will be reverting back to paired injectors as I have mentioned. Need to get the dash RPM indication functioning. Will keep the sequential ignition for the time being. Have to determine why the ECU cannot control the operation of the fuel pump when the key is turned to the ON position, I have a direct 12 VDC connection bypassing the ECU.

To revert back to the paired injectors have to change back to the OEM resistor pack.

More to follow.
 
Reverted back to paired injectors, also used semi-sequential as well. No joy, engine would not start. Kept at it for a couple of days, just went back to sequential injectors and engine started right up. Not going to beat the head against the wall, stay with sequential and go forward. have to visit the VE and spark tables, think I threw these out of whack but easy enough to make right.

Will be chasing the tach issue as well.

Cheers
 
Two thoughts for this post. Wide Band O2 (WBO2) sensor and cam sensors.

First, is a WBO2 needed. Not necessarily. It is a good diagnostic tool and provides information on how good your engine tune is. You put together a reasonable timing/spark/ignition table to start - lets call this the timing table. The same with the VE (fuelling) table.

The VE table is the first table to be adjusted to suit so that you can get the engine fuelling requirement where it should be. This table is paramount to getting the correct air-fuel ratio. The VE table cell values are just a number that is used in the calculated fuel requirement. The higher the number the more fuel is to be injected - rich, the smaller cell value number, less fuel is injected.

The timing table is next to be calibrated. When you increase a cell value - advancing the timing, you are in essence leaning out the air-fuel mixture because the fuel has a longer time to "burn". Reducing the cell value - retarding the timing, essentially reduces the fuel "burn" time and causes a fuel rich air-fuel mixture.

There is a sweet spot where you want the maximum fuel burn "pulse" to meet with the engine pistons for optimum engine performance and efficiency. This is approximately 10 to 15 degrees after TDC. You want the full injected and ignition to be at a point before TDC so that the fuel burn "pulse" meets this requirement.

It's a back and forth effort to get to well balanced VE and timing tables.

Once this is done, you can calibrate the AFR (WBO2) table to suit.

Do you need to use the AFR table, no. You can, but well calibrated VE and timing tables are the basis for calibrating the AFR table, and as such, is all you need.

The VE and timing tables produce an immediate engine response whereas the AFR table is an after the fact sensor for the ECU in that the WBO2 sensor that provides the input to the ECU is in response to what the engine is doing. The WBO2 signal to the ECU is based on what has happened, not what is happening or going to happen.

Honda realized this and did not incorporate an O2 sensor in these older FI GWs, and when new, emissions were probably quite good and did meet the requirement of the day. A place to install an O2 sensor didn't help.

Something to consider.

Camshaft sensor(s). These along with the crankshaft sensor provide the ECU with signal(s) to ensure correct fuel and ignition for the engine.

The crankshaft sensor is predominantly for engine timing, whereas the camshaft sensor(s) are for fuel injection.

The camshaft sensor(s) are used to indicate to the ECU when a cylinder is at TDC for engine "phasing". You can operate an engine without a camshaft sensor, but the crankshaft signal as the only crank/cam indication only allows the ECU to guesstimate what to do. It has stood the test of time, but the engine does not operate as effectively and efficiently as it could. It will operate well for most normal vehicle applications, but it can be better. Enter the camshaft sensor.

Should you wish to have sequential fuel and ignition, you will need a crankshaft and camshaft sensor. If you wish to stay with a wasted spark and paired injector engine profile, you can still benefit from a camshaft sensor.

The '85/'86 FI GWs have two camshaft sensors for accurate fuel injection and engine operation. Honda has achieved a semi-sequential fuelling using these two sensors, the engine is more fuel efficient, starts extremely well.

These sensors indicate to the ECU when a cylinder TDC has occurred and when to inject fuel into the engine. The Gr (right) sensor controls fuel injection for cylinders 1 and 3, the Gl (left) sensor controls fuel injection for cylinders 2 and 4.

Once the ECU receives a signal from a camshaft sensor indicating a cylinder TDC, 4 signal pulses from the crankshaft sensor after the signal from the camshaft sensor and the ECU triggers the respective fuel injector(s).

Very sophisticated for the time, and not much has changed since.

Are the camshaft sensors beneficial for any FI conversion, yes, even if you do not use these for sequential applications. The more and more precise information that the ECU has to use, the better the engine operation and performance will be. Bottom line, install a camshaft sensor, or a sensor that will send a signal to the ECU at half crankshaft speed.

Do you need an O2 sensor, no, but it's a good engine tuning tool.

Do you need a camshaft sensor or a facsimile of such, no, but It will permit the ECU to better control the engine operation and performance.

Just my thoughts on the FI system components.

Cheers
 
Very well worded ...As I dont have any experience with FI on a oldwing ..I do have plenty experiences on carb models and there lack of adjustment ..not only in fuel but also in timing ...oldwing motors use waisted spark system witch is ok till you add 2 timing belts ...witch has plus as it very reliable contact ...but the?system provides only one setting to timing the motor as in advancing the timing ...a simple extra. pully that could adjust the cam and tension on belt wpuld have been super smart. Way to have control of this ..making the best of both worlds of engineering ...something goes for the points timing being dual points you could not advance one side of motor without hurting the other side ..I don't know hold a didn T allow enough adjustment here ..these things are why single carb set ups suffer so much ..you basically can't dial in a carb by adjusting carb only .....the same deal applies to FI you can't get good results just changing fuel only ...in my opinion ...as said I have never been down this road ..and these?are?just thoughts ...on my hooch bike the C5 IGNITION eliminated all the timing hurdles and I was able to program the ignition or Paul did the owner of C5 ..AS things turn out my Weber two stage carb only works on the highest advance setting and was the biggest?reason the bike turn into a monster of power ..the ignition was dial into the carb ...I think This has a lot to do with FI TUNING AMONG OTHER ISSUES LIKE CAM PROFILE AMD SUCH ...AS SAID NICE READ I ENJOYED IT
 
Continuing with the journey. Have been contemplating switching to the Alpha-N fuelling profile using the TPS as load combined with RPM. Started with speed density (SD), but this fuelling profile on a bike has a very narrow tuning window.

Did a lot of research and found that quite a few converts, EFI conversion, started with SD fuelling, but eventually went to Alpha-N. Not for everyone, but worth a try.

The basis for this is that there is a considerable change in air flow when the throttle plates are first opened. It's not linear. It's like throwing a bucket of water at someone as soon as you start to play, then once going, there is less and less change in the amount of water being used. This is because the rate of change - Alpha, as the throttle is opened gets less and less.

I am using a single VE and spark table presently. There are provisions to use a second VE and spark table. Found a YouTube video regarding this, but the fellow did not mention the spark table. He is using the two tables to get better resolution on initial throttle opening up to 20% TPS and then from 20% up to 100%. The granularity is quite good. This will need to be explored.

There is one additional fuelling profile that can be used and the Speeduino ECU does allow for this, that of a blended fuelling profile where you use on profile within a certain window, then switch to the other fuelling profile for a different window.

The CX 500 ('82)/650 ('83) turbo motorcycles are examples of this. The fuelling profile is SD initially, then switches to an Alpha-N profile. This makes sense in that the CX motorcycles have "boost" and there is more air being being consumed at higher powers. For the '85 and '86 GW FI models without "boost", A blended fuelling profile where Alpha-N is used initially then transition to an SD fuelling profile.

There are benefits to each fuelling profile. For now I will investigate and pursue the Alha-N fuelling.

I have mentioned in other posts and threads that there are piggyback units that you plug into your motorcycle's system to improve performance, change fuelling characteristics and the likes. Thes units are generally programmed with an Alpha-N fuelling profile. I mentioned the this has to be done with caution because if the engine tune uses an SD fuelling profile, there could be conflicts between the OEM and aftermarket - something to be aware of.

For now it's another chapter.

Have decided to install a different Speeduino compatible ECU. I have many reasons for this, but mainly this will allow me to do bench projects. I would have to buy another Speeduino interface board to do this so I will use the one I have for that. The new ECU will also come configured with tach output - have to do a mod to the existing board to get this, and a baro sensor installed. Two important sensors in my mind. This new ECU uses the Arduino 2560 Pro (smaller footprint than the Arduino Mega 2560. The case (included) is very compact.

Will post more as I go forward.

Cheers
 
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Side trip - new ECU microprocessor is an Arduino Mega 2560. There have been some technology developments. Have been looking at a different Speeduino ECU because I want a Speeduino ECU for bench projects.

The new ECU I am looking at is a Spark Gap X4. The interface board is a Speeduino clone of the Speeduino v0.4.4 by Josh Stewart. It has a smaller footprint than the Speeduino x0.4.4. This new ECU uses an Arduino Mega Pro microprocessor. The Arduino Mega PRO performs and operates the same as the bigger brother Arduino Mega 2560. The Arduino Mega Pro has some additional features and usable pins, but essentially it's the same.

Ordered an Arduino Mega Pro and it was here today. The Arduino Mega 2560 is approximately 4" long by 2" wide. The Arduino Mega Pro is 2" long by 1 1/2" wide. The only other way to get a Speeduino ECU with a smaller footprint is to have the Arduino chip installed on the interface board. The Ocelot from WMTronics is such an ECU.

Picture of the Arduino Mega 2560 and the Arduino Mega Pro:
Arduino Old-New.JPG
Have to solder the pin connectors. Need the practice - should have ordered the Arduino Mega Pro with the connectors already attached to the board.
 

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