hooch blew a head gasket

[joedrum]

no it actually feels flat ..but the pics say it all ..its not yet...it is the side that blew .so it will get milled by hand some ...cant imagine how anyone at a machine shop or honda let this go as good ....shows all the signs of oneway milling at to fast a speed ..plain and simple chatter marks

i went after this head once already but stopped when i thought goo gasket would work fine ...but with copper im going to do more to it

 

[ekvh]

It looks like you are, but I'll share, get it flat on the part of the head where it goes into the coolant return elbow. My first two head gasket failures were likely due to the fact that my machinist figured the outside headbolts were the top of the head, but the center goes a little higher.

you can see my pencil line where he left it high after shaving 0.025" off the head, that undoubtedly made proper sealing impossible and made my torque readings of the center upper head bolt far from intended.

 

[joedrum]

pic

ok this is the redo of the machine marked head ...all done by hand ..

 

[dan filipi]

Looks nice Joe.

 

[slabghost]

Looking real good from here.

 

[Rednaxs60]

Great job, especially by hand, and having the confidence to install and use. Not a lot of folks out there that would do something like this. You sure you aren't an old naval artificer?

Cheers

 

[ekvh]

I found a maker of stainless rings to embed in the copper if anyone's interested. Irishcarbomb used them on his turbo build. I emailed the site for prices but no response yet. I doubt they're necessary unless going boosted. https://www.headgasket.com/compresring.html

 

[slabghost]

interesting.

 

[Ansimp]

+1 on the nice work as always Joe. :good:

 

[joedrum]

hmmmmm interesting eric ....but im going to gamble on copper gasket by itself with coating of some kind ...im certainly not supercharge as the motor is set set up all wrong for boosting ...it is at a very high level of intake induction already without boosting ...and im hoping not to have glued on rings on the gaskets ...the gamble is to do work and hopefully get the seal i need ...great post though as getting all the helpful info in the thread as can be

 

[joedrum]

seems my camera went totally bad cant get it to work anymore at all sheesh so now no pics ..

 

[dan filipi]

Need to get that fixed for copper install pics.

 

[joedrum]

LOL ill get right on it ....anyway going to go air boating and look for gators to watch with the family ...some swamp boating my favorite kind of boating

 

[ekvh]

Looking for my papers on annealing with no luck, so did some surfing and came across this: https://www.headgasket.com/preinstall.html

Which said :
Annealing
NOTE: It is unclear if annealing is needed in all applications. There are no controlled tests to date that definitively prove the benefit of annealing. It is felt that annealing will allow copper to "deform" slightly to fill in the surface marks left by machining and to deform where a steel wire "O" ring has been placed around the cylinder bore. Annealing makes the copper soft. This may defeat your purpose if you are trying to optimize on head gasket strength.

If our GWG P/5 gasket dressing is used we believe that annealing is not needed in most cases.

 

[joedrum]

well no pics ....but have been working on the heads and block ...ive appreciated all the input here on this thread about using copper gaskets ...i has helped me to make my path on things ...i can also now it can be said that both heads have been shaved some ..to take out imperfections of the ways things are done now days in machining ....plus the way things change in the operation of using the parts ..copper has a great heat transfer rate ...really like one of the top materials at this if not the best period ...this will transfer a lot of the head heat to the block and run cooler..id say goo gaskets are at the other end of this issue and heads run the hottest with goo gaskets used...so getting the heads to total flat condition without hi and low spots in machining that is almost assured with hi speed tools in rpm cutters can really only be done by hand really ...with slow cut and no heat syndrome going on ....the block is hard to get this as good as heads ....so far i havnt been able to get the head line up pins out ..and also it just not as easy to work on ...it is also why i dont like studs use to secure heads there just in the way ..like the line up pins ...

but once i get things all like i want them ill will test them on block for fit and see where im at ...so far the only thing off a faction as heads go is the head that didnt blow and it is actually in a good direction so things are looking rather good ....and i might not do anything to the copper before use ...i plan on being dead on ready to seal may not use sealant either

 

[dan filipi]

My thoughts on this are that if 2 parts are perfectly smooth and flat then a gasket isn't even needed, under a no pressure scenario at least. With no gasket you have 2 surfaces to seal together. Now add a copper sheet in between you now have 4 surfaces to seal.

I had more to say but running late and have to get to work.

 

[joedrum]

well one thing is for sure stock parts are a long ways from going without a gasket ...but i agree with your point ..heads and block done to upmost level and sealant applied to block and bolt it together may work great

 

[ekvh]

Heat the dowels, then slight in the non-drilling end of a bit that fits tightly in the dowel, then vise grips usual works for me. Vise grips leave marks but can be filed smooth.

 

[joedrum]

ive done that some..just not aggressively yet hadnt found the right filler yet for the pin need something better than i found so far...theres a perfect drill bit for it ..but i havnt got it here ..so far

 

[canuckxxxx]

dan filipi » Fri Mar 24, 2017 7:10 am[/url]":zbojyswi]
My thoughts on this are that if 2 parts are perfectly smooth and flat then a gasket isn't even needed, under a no pressure scenario at least. With no gasket you have 2 surfaces to seal together. Now add a copper sheet in between you now have 4 surfaces to seal.

I had more to say but running late and have to get to work.

But with 1200 engine you need a gasket to give piston to head clearance. Piston is slightly above top of bore at TDC.