Right side running hotter

[Heath]

Pony, don't worry about the fan. In our area I rarely have the fan come on. If your cooling system is working good you'll only get the fan coming on if your stuck in traffic for a while. My fan comes on when it hits slightly above center on the guage. Any time other than Summer (which we haven't had for 2 years) I have a problem with it not getting very warm and during the winter time it will stay in the skinny part of the warm zone.

 

[Pony Ruiz]

ok not worried about the fan issue anymore.

I rode around yesterday for a short while enough to get things warmed up.

I took a look at the plugs this am - the right (hotter) side is a nice shade of grey on the tip(the bent metal thing.

the left - like nothing happened. not oil fouled but clean.

seems to me I have a rich condition on the left and a lean and or normal condition on the right. -I'd sure like to know if it was normal then I could concentrate on 2/4. Anybody got a pic of a normal good running plug?

I'd post pic no camera at the moment.

I read randakks tech tips on lean vs. rich. Lots of stuff. My eyes kinda gloss over reading that.
list of symptoms not really a tutorial on what to do / where to start except with ignition and valves first. I am going to replace the plug wire/caps.....

So from re-reading this thread. I seems I should pull the carbs do a bench fuel test to see how much is getting to each carb? I like the idea of a elec. fuel pump. Any cheap 12v pump work? Recommendation?

Then if one is getting less set the float so it shuts off at a higher leveL and vice versa? at a higher level meaning instead of level with the carb body slightly below it (upsidedown)

Look for floats too high or too low.
Low will cause lean, high rich.

When operating the pump as someone mentioned open the drain screws to see/check the flow rate. check this?
If all the flow rates are good and or the bowl levels are good -bolt them on again? what else would you check while you had them off? Float needle valves? what to check here they are new?
CV slider action?


The other Q
would increasing the idle mix air on 2/4 richen things? as in more turns out?



I am sticking with it but it would sure be nice to hear/see/feel a properly running GL.

You guys are being nice and you are probably as tired of this as me. Sorry about that - short of selling this as is and buying a properly running bike which I should have done/will do next time but can't cause I am obsessed with this one and put too much $$ / time into this and other stuff on it - am stuck with it until the men in white coats :head bang: :fiddle: :head bang: come get me. Ahhhh gasping for air(no pun intended) When I get this resolved I am going to buy ya'll a virtual beer and maybe we can all do a virtual group hug!! :yahoo: or ya want to pass on this....?

:thanks:

 

[dan filipi]

Here's a very good thread on reading the plugs viewtopic.php?p=2002#p2002


If your going to use an electric fuel pump to fill the bowls it needs to be a max 2.5 psi otherwise the pressure might over ride the float seats and give a false level reading.
Might be easiest (read cheapest) way is to pull the spark plugs and use the starter to crank the bikes pump. With the plugs out the starter will run faster under little strain.

Before you pull the carbs, using a spray bottle with water start 'er up and spray the exhaust pipes one by one. How soon from a cold start it sizzles off on each pipe is a pretty good indicator if it's running evenly mixture wise on each cylinder.

 

[Pony Ruiz]

I looked at those plugs.
I could not place mine next to any of those and match them up. they are new so maybe they don't have enough time on them. hot side are grey. cold side didn't look like they did much igniting..nothing on them like new...

re: the idle mix screw turning in more or less fuel or air?

thx

 

[mcgovern61]

How old are your plug wires? The original Honda wires have a screw inside the cap that tends to come out with age. You can either pull the wires, cut the end and try screwing it back in...or just replace the wires. (I replaced mine)

Although it is a good chance the carbs are not adjusted right....the condition of the plugs (staying new looking) kinda points to wires not sending full current to the plugs...a common problem with 30 year old bikes.

 

[slabghost]

mixture screws on these control fuel not air. Out is richer. Proper adjustment is to set each to the highest rpm you can get. Then reset idle and set the next air mix screw to highest rpm. Reset idle again and adjust 3rd and fourth carbs. Each carb affects the others so it's recommended you do all 4 adjustments twice. If your floats are right your mix should be right after this procedure. After setting these set synchrinization and forget the carbs. If the problem persists it isn't the carbs.

 

[dan filipi]

I looked at those plugs.
I could not place mine next to any of those and match them up. they are new so maybe they don't have enough time on them. hot side are grey. cold side didn't look like they did much igniting..nothing on them like new...

re: the idle mix screw turning in more or less fuel or air?

thx

In leans the mixture ( less gas), out richens the mixture (more gas).

 

[Pony Ruiz]

I'll use the bike's pump.
out of curiosity I pulled the bowls from below from the previous rack ( the one I rebuilt ) and looked at the fuel level. granted some has evaped but maybe evenly...

1-3 about 1/2 to less than 1/2 full - does this explain lean/starved on this side

2-4 about 3/4 full (alot more) - a rich/flooded

Level should be just below the bowl gasket.

as in almost to the top without spilling out? None of them were close to that,

If this is the case and all the floats are basically the same does it point to the needle valves as McG alluded to earlier? As in why 1-3 don't get enough fuel? Floats are the same...

If not sealing - too much fuel right. If kinda stuck closed not enough fuel.

unscientifically I adjusted the left cool side mix screw in 1 turn. and rt hot side out 1 turn. no affect whatsoever.

Gonna try filling the bowls on these carbs first. How do I gauge when they are full but not too full?

McG I have some plug wire - I am going to replace the wire.

though this rack is running better - I'd guess the symptoms are the same just less severe

 

[Pony Ruiz]

I had my share of carb issues:

McG. I read your thread. How did you test and fix the needle valves to see if they were sealing?

If mine are suspect they aren't letting enough gas in.

 

[dan filipi]

Yes, almost to the top but not spilling out.

1/2 the bowl I reckon it was running lean on that side.
Was that the side which was getting hot? Would explain that.

The other side which had more gas in the bowls could be running right but I'd fill them with the pump and see where they are now to eliminate the evaporation factor.
Knowing where those were actually shutting off will help source the problem.

 

[slabghost]

Screw some clear tubing in the bowl drains and hold the ends straight up alongside the bowls. Then fill the carbs with fuel. If memory serves the level in the tubes should be about 5mm below the top of the float bowls.

 

[Pony Ruiz]

Yes, almost to the top but not spilling out.

1/2 the bowl I reckon it was running lean on that side.Yes
Was that the side which was getting hot? Would explain that.

The other side which had more gas in the bowls could be running right but I'd fill them with the pump and see where they are now to eliminate the evaporation factor.
Knowing where those were actually shutting off will help source the problem.
gas level may be right but still running rich as in no power/too cool

Screw some clear tubing in the bowl drains and hold the ends straight up alongside the bowls. Then fill the carbs with fuel. If memory serves the level in the tubes should be about 5mm below the top of the float bowls.

I saw that in McG's thread - off to buy some now and maybe a cheap camera. Break time!! :heat:

 

[dan filipi]

Yeah pics would be cool!!

 

[mcgovern61]

I had my share of carb issues:

McG. I read your thread. How did you test and fix the needle valves to see if they were sealing?

If mine are suspect they aren't letting enough gas in.

Good question....my memory does not serve me well! (Tough gettin old) :smilie_happy:

I remember turning the carbs over with the bowels off, floats off and just set the pins in to see if they would stop gas from leaking. Took the pins out and spun them in wet sand paper (1200 grit) just a touch to clean the tips. Also cleaned the seat where the float pins made contact with crumbled tin foil. Dropped them back in and dripped gas in around them until they sealed without leaking. Then put the floats on and filled the carbs again. I filled them from the tank by taking the line from the petcock and running it down to the floor where the carbs were. Full tank of gas will fill the carbs quick when you open the petcock. I then would turn them 45 degrees to see if they would leak.

 

[Pony Ruiz]

McG:

thanks for that. I will try that just for giggles after I do the fuel level thing.

when you drop gas in and around where do you look for / see gas leaking if it leaks?

I have my tubing almost prepped to do the gas fill test.

So all the bowls will fill to the proper level with just gravity and a full gas tank?

With the potential issues I have shouldn't I see how the bowls fill with the fuel pump.

Once the first one fills stop pumping and see where the other ones are in relation to that one?

thanks!

 

[slabghost]

Don't stop filling until all bowls stop filling.

 

[Pony Ruiz]

Ok SlabG

I forget - what is this procedure going to tell me?

And what are we supposed to do after all the bowls are full?

I thought I was supposed to find out which ones fill/don't fill at a certain rate comparatively - to determine which cylinders are starved for fuel and which ones have too much.

Again. I know nothing.

thanks

 

[joedrum]

hmmmmm ....the first thing i do if the carbs are out of the bike .....is take the drain screws out of the bowls place them flat and hooked up to a gravity feed tank....raise the tank and see if all the carbs are getting good feed to the bowls .....if things are good they will have gas flowing stong quick ....if ones got a clogged float screen this will so it right off the bat.....if the rack passes that test ...then i put the drains back in good ...and raise the gravity tank up and see if the float seats are stopping the gas flow ......if these two test pass then i might try them on the bike ....usealy having to take them off for more work ....but sometimes you dont have to take the flost pins out if the carbs passed the gas go and stop test :mrgreen: i dont know if this will help you but here it is :headscratch: :mrgreen:

 

[Pony Ruiz]

see if the float seats are stopping the gas flow

if they don't where will the gas show up? the plenum?

this is only done gravity feed?

the mech fuel pump keeps pumping gas in the bowls regardless of the level? When the floats raise and push in the needle valve - the pump keeps pumping right- (its running off the revs.)? where does all that gas go? Or are things happening so fast that as soon as the bowl fills it is emptied/gas is used and so there isn't an overflow situation if everything is good. just trying to comprehend...

At the moment I am working on the first rack so it is off the bike. I have not been back to it the last two days _ I had to work!

So as to eliminate one factor and make the bike run better hopefully, I am going to buy some spark plug ends ngk 102 deg. these
https://www.randakks.com/Ignition%20Parts.htm

what size wire and where would you buy it by the foot? 6ft enough?

thanks

 

[slabghost]

Ok SlabG

I forget - what is this procedure going to tell me?

And what are we supposed to do after all the bowls are full?

I thought I was supposed to find out which ones fill/don't fill at a certain rate comparatively - to determine which cylinders are starved for fuel and which ones have too much.

Again. I know nothing.

thanks

Doing the test with the clear tubing in the float bowl drains will show the final level of fuel so you'll know which floats need adjustment.