Spin-on Oil filter option

[dan filipi]

" Bypass 8-11" for the wix, is that 8-11 psi?
Much lower than I thought it would be!
That would mean the filter gets full flow thru the medium only at idle.
That doesn't seem right.

It appears then that spin ons have a bypass or at least the wix does so if the threads on that nipple match the threads on a spin on, is long enough, and the filter base seal it sits on the block is the right size then we may have a spin on option for our bike!
This is good news.

My next question would be what about the filter loosening from vibration?
Would be a good idea to check it often until proven reliable.

 

[ekvh]

Sounds very promising. Would like to hear more opinions before trying it.

 

[AApple]

The Wix filter that skiri251 posted above DOES have a built-in bypass. I just used one yesterday on a Scoobydoo trans. :good: The by-pass pressure opening spec is a bit low, it may seem. Then again, since not ALL filters HAVE the bypass, using one without it would be OK if you changed the oil regularly....like we ALL do.... :roll: :smilie_happy:
On the other info posted, the spring you see at the closed end of the filter is there to keep the filter element sealed against the base plate, much like the spring on the stock 'Wing filter element. It is NOT any part of a by-pass system. :mrgreen:


btw...I'm not askeered to be the guinea-pig on this. Soon as I find a filter that fits, that is. :thank_you:

 

[skiri251]

The Wix filter that skiri251 posted above DOES have a built-in bypass. I just used one yesterday on a Scoobydoo trans. :good: The by-pass pressure opening spec is a bit low, it may seem. Then again, since not ALL filters HAVE the bypass, using one without it would be OK if you changed the oil regularly....like we ALL do.... :roll: :smilie_happy:
On the other info posted, the spring you see at the closed end of the filter is there to keep the filter element sealed against the base plate, much like the spring on the stock 'Wing filter element. It is NOT any part of a by-pass system. :mrgreen:


btw...I'm not askeered to be the guinea-pig on this. Soon as I find a filter that fits, that is. :thank_you:

Okay, so bypass will look more like stock filter bolt?


Honda VFR forum site I found on the google search explained about the bypass operation.
According to that (I don't have URL handy), bypass opens rather frequently. Like on cold start, full accel from idle, not only from crogged filter element.

Currently I am the guinea pig on the chrome spin-on filter. But considering this is available for CB750 I hope it'll be just fine.

But if it indeed blocks oil flow, will the oil pressure indicator light turns on? I don't know where in the flow pass the sensor is placed.

 

[dan filipi]

My understing is the bypass will kick in under high pressure high volume conditions.
Cold thick oil and high rpm will both do.

Without a bypass flow it would stand to reason then oil would be restricted thru the filter element since its the filter element that would cause the restriction making the bypass open in the first place.

Anyone like to add to this?

The oil light imdicates low pressure, 2 psi.
I don't see how no bypass would ever cause the oil light to come on.

 

[joedrum]

if the filter was completly cloged or almost it could shut the supply down belowthe pump theshold of operating :mrgreen:

 

[skiri251]

Okay, this seems to be a more realistic schematic of built-in bypass valve although my previous reference may also depict bypass valve just in a little more symbolic way.

And my chrome oil filter got it!
I can see that cylinder(?), valve, and the spring.
Yehe!

Now as for local replacement.. The female thread of the filter base appears to be 3/4"-16TPI so metric line of WIX filters won't fit. I guess I really should got to local Napa.

 

[skiri251]

The oil light imdicates low pressure, 2 psi.
I don't see how no bypass would ever cause the oil light to come on.

If the sensor is located down flow side of the filter, then pressure builds up at the up flow side of the filter, then there may not be enough pressure at the sensor.

Oil Pump -> Filter -> Pressure Sensor

 

[AApple]

That's a great graphic for the filter. :good:
If you look in the filter, you will be able to see the by-pass...it will NOT be flush with the end of the filter media(paper element). As has been said, not all filters will have this feature.
As far as the by-pass opening when starting a cold engine, that really shouldn't happen. The filter element should be able to pass enough oil thru it without building up enough cold pressure to pop the by-pass open. Of course, the older(and more miles) the filter, that might come into play more often.
The design of the by-pass has always been to open if the volume of oil entering is more than the volume goin thru the media. As has been mentioned, it doesn't have to be a restricted filter to open the by-pass. Back in the day, when building our race engines, we would epoxy the by-pass valve closed, so all oil would be filtered at all times. We of course changed oil in race engines quite often, so it wasn't really an issue. Did the same thing on most of my street cars, too.
Without a bypass system, a restricted filter would cause lower oil pressure at the gauge/light...depending on where in the circuit the gauge/light sensor is....most(99.9%) are after the filter. With a restricted filter w/no bypass, there would simply not be much oil going to lube the engine, thus the lower pressure. The pressure between the oil pump and the filter would definitely be HIGH!

 

[dan filipi]

The question is then is there a filter out there, inexpensive with a bypass that will fit that thread as a replacement.

 

[AApple]

Apparently, the one skiri251 bought does have one. If we can just figure out a part # crossover, and where to source the nipple, we be in bidness.
I'll be changing my erl this weekend....I just haven't had the time to do it yet. I have several filters at the house I'll be looking at to see if they will fit, and have the correct thread. There are nipples available with different thread specs on either end, so if we(I) can locate one that will fit the bike engine on one end, and a common oil filter on the other(if different), it would seem like a done deal. :yes:


If all else fails, the kit that skiri251 bought DOES fit the 'Wing, and comes with the nipple. It's reasonably priced, too, so it wouldn't be a pain to just get one of those kits....then just cross-reference a filter that would fit, and have a bypass. :ahem:

 

[slabghost]

I hope someone sources the nipple and filter for this mod soon. It would make the oil change so much nicer. A nice chrome cover would finish the look nicely and add just a bit more protection from accidental puncture.

 

[AApple]

There are chrome filter "covers" for some Chevy and Ford filters. They just slide right over the filter, and a magnet or sticky tape holds it on. It would be so kewl if a regular Chevy oil filter would fit on the 'Wing!

 

[slabghost]

There are chrome filter "covers" for some Chevy and Ford filters. They just slide right over the filter, and a magnet or sticky tape holds it on. It would be so kewl if a regular Chevy oil filter would fit on the 'Wing!

Agreed! I hope one of the short versions can be found. I'm a little concerned having one sticking way out front.

 

[dan filipi]

The filter the oil change place puts on my 2 v8 Chebies is a stubby little thing, prolly 1/2 the length of the bike.
I should start telling them to put a larger one on.

 

[skiri251]

I have been searching for that elusive local replacement spin-on filters and so far I found none.
This is WIX only since WIX web page will tell you gasket OD/ID and either or not the filter got a bypass.

The chrome filter got around 3.5" OD gasket and that is the necessary size for the GL crank case flange.
I found some filters with 3.4" OD gasket but they are all without bypass. Plus 3.4" is not big enough.

I doubt even with diffrent thread size nipples (say metric) we can easily find a filter with that big gasket OD.

Typical Harley stuff with 3/4"x16 thread got 2.7" OD gasket. That means we need an adaptor plate.
Randakk's adaptor costs $60. Chrome filter costs $16. Typical spin-on costs $6. So if I buy Randakk's and do filter change 10 times, I can recover the cost of the adaptor.

But now I got kinda obsessed with spin-on conversion on the cheap.
I had used chrome filter around in the garage so I made the adaptor plate out of it. It only took 15 minutes.

Brought out my favourite tool, hacksaw.

Filter base plate (filter side), extrusion for the thread was ground off, adaptor nipple in.

Filter base plate (engine side), will tack weld the nipple

This is typical filter (Bosch) with smaller gasket OD ~2.7"

I can use it on GL this way.

So you can buy this chrome filter once, use it. Then for the next filter change you use the old filter to make an adaptor plate and buy Harley spin on filter. It will be readily available at the local auto parts store.

Of course you can pay $60 for Randakk's nice aluminum adaptor too.

 

[dan filipi]

So there ARE options for a spin on. We just need to figure out the part numbers.
I like inexpensive and would be willing to invest the $20 for the spin on filter above if just to get the nipple, personally I just can't justify investing $60 for Randalls adapter although relatively that is a very reasonable price considering the quality and proven design.

 

[skiri251]

We have lots of filter choices once we use the adaptor plate. Most of the filters for Harley (some of them have 11/16" threads or even metric!, however) will work. You can get the part# from WIX web page.

https://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/index.asp

For example, this one for SportsStar 1200.

https://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/PartDetail.asp?Part=57148

 

[scdmarx]

What keeps the adapter from screwing off with the used filter next oil change?

 

[skiri251]

What keeps the adapter from screwing off with the used filter next oil change?

well, nothing..

Adaptor plate is held against crank flange with rubber gasket, filter is held against adaptor plate with rubber gasket.
I am hoping that simply holding the plate with one hand while screwing off the filter with the other is enough.

If that doesn't work, I have these from HF.