Here she is, I named her, "the Wanderer "

[Denver]

Finding someone who knows how to heliarc weld, as well as tig weld, MIGHT be able to repair, but if your careful you'll be fine, with no need. :salute:

 

[made2care]

manuals says do not move cam while the belts are off. How am i supposed to line up the marks before the belts go on without moving the cam pulley.

 

[dan filipi]

Just before putting the heads on, I rotate the engine to about a 1/4 turn before #1 is at tdc.
This way when the heads are on, the cams can be lined up on their marks then crank turned to tdc.
So the sequence is put cams on their marks, then rotate crank to its mark, not the reverse.

 

[mcgovern61]

made2care » Thu Oct 22, 2015 8:56 pm[/url]":2n70an8i]
manuals says do not move cam while the belts are off. How am i supposed to line up the marks before the belts go on without moving the cam pulley.

:hihihi: Don't pay attention to the manual too strongly here. The intent there is to not rotate the cams so that they become way off and possibly out of time. That is why you make the marks on the cam pulley and the crank pulley so that as you set up the belt, you can give a little turn as needed to get the belt on and make sure your marks are lined up.

 

[slabghost]

You have all the adjusters backed off. I presume you have the cylinders halfway down. Set the cams where they should be then bring the crank where it should be. Then put the belts on. Turn the crank to be sure the belts are properly positioned in relation to the marks. Adjust valves for cylinder one and turn over slowly by hand to be sure nothing hits. One step at a time. Be sure everything lines up.

 

[Ansimp]

mcgovern61 » Fri Oct 23, 2015 1:00 pm[/url]":13bed6vj]

made2care » Thu Oct 22, 2015 8:56 pm[/url]":13bed6vj]
manuals says do not move cam while the belts are off. How am i supposed to line up the marks before the belts go on without moving the cam pulley.

:hihihi: Don't pay attention to the manual too strongly here. The intent there is to not rotate the cams so that they become way off and possibly out of time. That is why you make the marks on the cam pulley and the crank pulley so that as you set up the belt, you can give a little turn as needed to get the belt on and make sure your marks are lined up.

+1 :good:

 

[Denver]

Critical to have right, but not hard, :nea: just run it through your mind, take your time, & it will make you grin, when it finally clicks in your head. :yahoo: Cars, bikes, trucks, valve timing is all pretty much the same. :yes:

 

[chilidawg]

Okay here's my 10 cents.

I not only, (as others have) suggest you ignore the manual for this purpose, but I also suggest that you just go with the guys that have actually done it. Recently!

That manual was most likely written in about 1980, 35 years ago, most likely before your bike was ever built, and well before it had 30 odd years to stew before you decided to restore it.

I also strongly suggest that you remove the cam wheels and rockers, and replace the valve seals, It could be why the smoke is from the left hand side. if you don't have all the tools and equipment for it, then that's what your local small engine shop is for. It shouldn't be anything new to them. they can most likely clean them up and re-surface the heads.

If your worried about parts availability, I've got a set of new cam seals and a set of new valve seals that you can have for free + shipping, (about $8 will work,) just as long as you follow this job through!

My only other suggestion (for now,) is that you do not torque down the cam carriers to the 20 ft/lbs that is in the manual, but just give them about 12. They're old, that's about all they can take. You really don't want to be going down that Helli-coiling road, like I nearly did or finding yourself a new head. (I had another head on hand).

Forget the book Fella, go with what these people tell you, they only have your bikes best interests at heart.

 

[joedrum]

ok....i move the cam in the heads after take off all the time ....

why it is the only way to check the heads out ......again a rubber hammer works good to lightly hit around on valve springs while rotating by hand ...you can feel for rough spots ...it is good idea to lossen all rocker adjusting screws back till there flush with rocker at bottom and snug lock back so they wont come out ....

this way its easier to rotate by hand ....at this time cleaning everything up whats going on ....usually a wire brush wil clean valve springs and reach the stem also and by moving the valve through it strike you can clean its entire movement...

cleaning inside the the combustion chamber happens now too ...just dontt get over dumb hands while cleaning things ..i lioke chor boys for kitchen use there aggressive but used with touch there great....

also like scotch brite pads ....green are fine it seems ...cut a slit in them long ways in the middle only ...from here you can open the valve with cam gear and slip this over the valve and then close the valve down on it some ..it is now pinch in place between valve and head ...and you can grab the ends and rotate it to clean back side of valve and valve seat some ...

after head is all cleanded up now its time to go after cleaning gasket area ......again smart hands are the deal ..take your time ..use touch and all to clean and use what ever ...chor boy works good so dose scrapers ..putty knife lots of things ....

once all clean motor block has to be cleaned to...this is a non replaceable part ...THE MOTOR ...no messing it up......this is most important part ..cleaning ...sometime on oldwings the cylinder botom sides are glazed with build up ...to clean out ...this has to be done with great touch it it needs it ....it a compression getter as glaze will slightly make rins deform while moving loosing a bit of power making ....

most times i never redo valves as when im cleaning there is no nee do to...this is like the caveman tech way to redo heads without take them apart at all .....

so as manual says never move cam ....i always do ...post pics of heads once off so we can see them ..and what shape ther in ....

 

[made2care]

dan filipi » Yesterday, 9:58 pm[/url]":2r85am5i]
Just before putting the heads on, I rotate the engine to about a 1/4 turn before #1 is at tdc.
This way when the heads are on, the cams can be lined up on their marks then crank turned to tdc.
So the sequence is put cams on their marks, then rotate crank to its mark, not the reverse.

Okay, so after I have installed the head and the bolts are torqued, I am allowed to turn the cam pulleys to lineup to their marks ( valve adjusters are still all the the way out) and then rotate engine. I guess realistically, that would be the only way to get everything lined up, with that being said, why would the manual emphasize in bold lettering that once belts are off, the cams should not be moved while attached to the block.

 

[made2care]

chilidawg » Yesterday, 11:44 pm[/url]":1s2viuxb]
Okay here's my 10 cents.

I not only, (as others have) suggest you ignore the manual for this purpose, but I also suggest that you just go with the guys that have actually done it. Recently!

That manual was most likely written in about 1980, 35 years ago, most likely before your bike was ever built, and well before it had 30 odd years to stew before you decided to restore it.

I also strongly suggest that you remove the cam wheels and rockers, and replace the valve seals, It could be why the smoke is from the left hand side. if you don't have all the tools and equipment for it, then that's what your local small engine shop is for. It shouldn't be anything new to them. they can most likely clean them up and re-surface the heads.

If your worried about parts availability, I've got a set of new cam seals and a set of new valve seals that you can have for free + shipping, (about $8 will work,) just as long as you follow this job through!

My only other suggestion (for now,) is that you do not torque down the cam carriers to the 20 ft/lbs that is in the manual, but just give them about 12. They're old, that's about all they can take. You really don't want to be going down that Helli-coiling road, like I nearly did or finding yourself a new head. (I had another head on hand).

Forget the book Fella, go with what these people tell you, they only have your bikes best interests at heart.

thank you very much for your offer of parts. will definitely keep this in mind. Also, I know you are saying don't pay attention to the manual, but since I have never done this before, that can be difficult to do.

 

[mcgovern61]

With that being said, why would the manual emphasize in bold lettering that once belts are off, the cams should not be moved while attached to the block?

It is intended that if a belt is off, you do not want to change the position of the valves by moving the cam assuming the new belt is going right back on. Not bad advice if you are only doing a belt swap.

But, after pulling a head and say replace the valve seals, you are going to be moving the cam shaft, even removing it! At some point in that process, you will have to line up the cam shaft and valves again. Not a big deal. This is where marking the cam pulley and crank pulley come into their glory!!

 

[dan filipi]

made2care » 20 minutes ago[/url]":tfhhbz3x]

dan filipi » Yesterday, 9:58 pm[/url]":tfhhbz3x]
Just before putting the heads on, I rotate the engine to about a 1/4 turn before #1 is at tdc.
This way when the heads are on, the cams can be lined up on their marks then crank turned to tdc.
So the sequence is put cams on their marks, then rotate crank to its mark, not the reverse.

Okay, so after I have installed the head and the bolts are torqued, I am allowed to turn the cam pulleys to lineup to their marks ( valve adjusters are still all the the way out) and then rotate engine. I guess realistically, that would be the only way to get everything lined up, with that being said, why would the manual emphasize in bold lettering that once belts are off, the cams should not be moved while attached to the block.

It emphasizes it because if other precautions aren't followed like has been laid out here, a valve can be bent.

 

[Tom_Charlton]

+1 on breaking the glaze.

I use a ball hone and an electric drill. Get the hone wet with ATF or engine oil before starting. Move the hone in and out while turning it to create a swirling pattern on the cylinder walls. The ATF/oil lubricates the balls to keep them from creating deep scratches in the walls. The key to everything is to go slow and constantly check.

After honing, wipe the walls clean of residue with a clean rag and a cleaning solution. After that, wet a rag with engine oil and wipe the walls down to prevent rust and provide initial lubrication when you start the engine.

 

[made2care]

You guys are are very helpful and again , thank you so much for all your help.
Good news, I had to take my truck down to my local mechanic and mentioned what I was attempting. He explained everything, which validated what everyone has been saying all along. He also said he would clean the head, check for warpage and replace the valve seals. So, Here we go. I will get a pick of the cylinders to you sometime today. Chow for now.

 

[dan filipi]

We don't need no sticking validation.

Everyone that's posted in this thread has done the deed at least once, most many times so trust what you're reading here.

 

[AApple]

dan filipi » Fri Oct 23, 2015 9:45 am[/url]":133g88qe]
We don't need no sticking validation.

:smilie_happy: :smilie_happy: :smilie_happy:

While that's true,ya gotta remember not everyone has the experience that a lot of us do on these things. I was askeered to do ANYTHING on mine when I first got it, and the Clymer manual I have is not really confidence inspiring. Had I not had youse old timers to guide me, I'd still be trying to figure out how to change the erl properly. The guidance, and encouragement this site provides to newcomers is second to none. Heck...I've even managed to pull the engine, change the stator, do the heads/timing belts, etc. WITH ya'lls help. Otherwise, I would have a big piece of Honda scrap metal in the yard right now...

 

[Ansimp]

AApple » Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:35 am[/url]":31g5bhwj]

dan filipi » Fri Oct 23, 2015 9:45 am[/url]":31g5bhwj]
We don't need no sticking validation.

:smilie_happy: :smilie_happy: :smilie_happy:

While that's true,ya gotta remember not everyone has the experience that a lot of us do on these things. I was askeered to do ANYTHING on mine when I first got it, and the Clymer manual I have is not really confidence inspiring. Had I not had youse old timers to guide me, I'd still be trying to figure out how to change the erl properly. The guidance, and encouragement this site provides to newcomers is second to none. Heck...I've even managed to pull the engine, change the stator, do the heads/timing belts, etc. WITH ya'lls help. Otherwise, I would have a big piece of Honda scrap metal in the yard right now...

:good: :salute:

 

[made2care]

Okay, left head is off, this gasket is toast. Just a couple of light taps and she came off. Water present in cylinder wall , surprise. Never appeared as though the gasket even bonded.

8

• slabghost
• Dec 13, 2015

9

• slabghost
• Dec 13, 2015

 

[slabghost]

Looks very good actually. The gasket isn't supposed to "bond" just seal. Looks like it will clean up nice.